--------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 147 RAILROAD FANS Ref: EEU00003 Date: 10/23/97 From: PHIL KANE Time: 03:48pm \/To: KEN FREEMAN (Read 0 times) Subj: Re: iron horses In a message to Bob Wallace dated 10-20-97 20:22, Ken Freeman wrote: KF> Does Amtrak also do maintainence for CalTrain? Yes. The line is owned by the Joint Powers Board, a three-county entity, who contracts total operation (dispatch, operation, MOW) to Amtrak-West. --- PCBoard (R) v15.21/M 100 * Origin: HINTS (1:125/467) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 147 RAILROAD FANS Ref: EEV00000 Date: 10/20/97 From: GREGORY PROCTER Time: 03:10pm \/To: BOB WINGENDER (Read 0 times) Subj: Re: iron horses -=> Quoting Bob Wingender to Rick Jones <=- BW> Hello Rick! BW> Sunday October 19 1997 21:24, Rick Jones wrote to Ken Freeman: RJ> The UP X9000 (or is it 9000X?) was, IIRC, a 4-10-2 three cylinder RJ> locomotive. BW> Make that a 4-12-2, largest solid frame loco built. The Russians built a 4.14.4! So make that the "largest successful solid frame loco built". Greg.P. ... Catch the Blue Wave! --- FMail 1.02 * Origin: Midi-Maze BBS...Christchurch...New Zealand... (3:770/355) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 147 RAILROAD FANS Ref: EEV00001 Date: 10/25/97 From: WES LEATHEROCK Time: 08:11am \/To: PHIL KANE (Read 0 times) Subj: Re: iron horses -=> Quoting Phil Kane to Tom Walker <=- TW> I understsnd the situation is so desperate that they even requested TW> permission to send some 60,000 Containers through the Panama Canal on TW> a ships to aleviate the situation. But were turned down. PK> Who is the "they" that requested "permission" and who turned PK> "them" down? PK> My experience is if you put enough cash on the barrelhead, PK> SeaLand and others will pick up and deliver at the "multi-modal" PK> terminal tommorrow morning (their Oakland, CA terminal is served PK> by the UP, in fact). PK> Of course SeaLand developed the "land bridge" with UP and PK> ConRail to cut down coast-to-coast container time. As I am sure you know, no permission at all was required and UP had the plan completely ready to go when they announced it. The shippers screamed loudly, and U.P. abandoned the plan quickly. ___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.20 [NR] --- PCBoard (R) v15.23/M 5 * Origin: Beggar's Forum IV (405) 787-2540 (1:147/58) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 147 RAILROAD FANS Ref: EEV00002 Date: 10/25/97 From: TOM WALKER Time: 09:03am \/To: BOB WINGENDER (Read 0 times) Subj: Re: iron horses BW> It is mentioned in several movies I have that "The BigBoy could pull a trai BW> miles long on level track". Would love to have seen that! And I believe tha BW> would be more than 100 cars, right? Whiel the Big Boys are no longer arround to Compete recently UP had their Challendger pull a record long train. As I recall it was something like 5 miles long. --- GEcho 1.00 * Origin: 9-1-1 FF's LEO's OSHA COMMS (619) 669-0385 (1:202/911) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 147 RAILROAD FANS Ref: EEV00003 Date: 10/25/97 From: TOM WALKER Time: 09:06am \/To: WES LEATHEROCK (Read 0 times) Subj: Re: Iron Horses WL> A big factor is the strength of the drawbars, which is why WL> in mountainous territory (and sometimes even in less milly territory) WL> there are mid-train helpers and helpers on the rear end. All that WL> power on the front would pull out a drawbar. I also heard with all the engines on the front it was possable to pull the cars off the track on a curve if the train was too long. --- GEcho 1.00 * Origin: 9-1-1 FF's LEO's OSHA COMMS (619) 669-0385 (1:202/911) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 147 RAILROAD FANS Ref: EEV00004 Date: 10/25/97 From: BOB WALLACE Time: 11:36am \/To: BOB WINGENDER (Read 0 times) Subj: iron horses Hi, Bob. BW>Was trying to remember the "Wasatch Range" in last message but couldn't. Sti BW>wouldn't be as big a territory that the Challenger can go. Just try to BW>visualize 1 more driver on each engine and you'll have a "BIG BOY". :) (I kn BW>still not the same). Not a problem for the Big Boys to work themselves through the Wasatch. They're nothing more than a pair of Northern-class engines tied to a single frame, albeit with a pivot point under the front section of the boiler for the first set of four drivers. BW>Think I've got that but I remember seeing the smaller engines of 'Frisco' pu BW>100+ cars when I was growing up beside the Springfield-Memphis mainline. Recall that just west of the Cheyenne freight yard, the U.P.'s main starts up a grade on its way to the summit of Sherman Hill, something like 25 miles west of Cheyenne? What the U.P. did with their large engines was to stop for water some part of the way up Sherman, including cutting off the lead engine on a two-engine "lead" at the front of trains, and stop to allow any helper on the rear to water up, too. Imagine the fun of having to spot two or three Challengers or Big Boys under the water tank each and every trip over that hill!? Not quite like parking one's car at the gas station pump. BW>It is mentioned in several movies I have that "The BigBoy could pull a train BW>miles long on level track". Would love to have seen that! And I believe that BW>would be more than 100 cars, right? Given something on the order of 4,000 horsepower in each of the Big Boys, highly likely. Not too shabby for a museum piece! --- # SLMR 2.1a # Windows 95 = Macintosh '89! # PDQWK 2.5 #51 --- * Origin: NetComm BBS 303-730-7045 (1:104/603.0) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 147 RAILROAD FANS Ref: EEV00005 Date: 10/25/97 From: BOB WALLACE Time: 05:08pm \/To: WES LEATHEROCK (Read 0 times) Subj: Iron Horses WL> A rough rule of thumb used to be that a 100-car train was WL>about a mile long. Of course, with the varying length of cars now, WL>that may not be right on the nose, but still not too far off, usually. The rule of thumb coming from a given railroad's operating department so as to know how long any passing sidings need to be to allow for one train to get out of the way of another traveling (usually) in the opposite direction. Aside from Amtrak passing a slower train traveling in the same direction. One reason for many railroads today giving the number of units up front, the number of loads and empties in the train, and the total length of that specific train. Or, in the case of Amtrak, no need for loads and empties, but the total number of cars. WL> Trains of up to around 10,000 feet in length are not all that WL>rare now, leading to the need for much longer sidings than used to be WL>needed. Did you mean to say feet here, or tons? A train stretching out for some 10,000 feet is nearly two miles long! WL> A big factor is the strength of the drawbars, which is why WL>in mountainous territory (and sometimes even in less milly territory) WL>there are mid-train helpers and helpers on the rear end. All that WL>power on the front would pull out a drawbar. As evidenced by busted drawbars littering the sides of U.P.'s main going east between Laramie and Cheyenne, as has been noted in several Trains articles over the years. Many of those broken drawbars coming from the 10,000-ton unit coal trains pulling that hill (or attempting to) from a dead stop. --- # SLMR 2.1a # As a computer, I find your faith in technology amusing. # PDQWK 2.5 #51 --- * Origin: NetComm BBS 303-730-7045 (1:104/603.0) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 147 RAILROAD FANS Ref: EEW00000 Date: 10/26/97 From: WES LEATHEROCK Time: 07:03pm \/To: BOB WALLACE (Read 0 times) Subj: Iron Horses -=> Quoting Bob Wallace to Wes Leatherock <=- WL> Trains of up to around 10,000 feet in length are not all that WL>rare now, leading to the need for much longer sidings than used to be WL>needed. BW> BW> Did you mean to say feet here, or tons? A train stretching out for BW> some 10,000 feet is nearly two miles long! Yup. Actually, the trains are not usually that long--I believe some coal trains now are around 150 cars or so, probably a mile and a half or more--but it is necessary to have room for clearance and desirable to have the sidings long enough that the train moving through the siding will not have to come to a complete stop. ___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.20 [NR] --- FLAME v1.1 * Origin: The SANDBOX ** MidWest City OK 405.737.9540 (1:147/34) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 147 RAILROAD FANS Ref: EEW00001 Date: 10/26/97 From: BOB WINGENDER Time: 11:33am \/To: TOM WALKER (Read 0 times) Subj: iron horses Hello Tom. Saturday October 25 1997 09:03, Tom Walker wrote to Bob Wingender: BW>> It is mentioned in several movies I have that "The BigBoy could pull a BW>> trai miles long on level track". Would love to have seen that! And I BW>> believe tha would be more than 100 cars, right? TW> Whiel the Big Boys are no longer arround to Compete recently UP had heir TW> Challendger pull a record long train. As I recall it was something like TW> miles long. When did this occur and if it did, it would be all over the news, in Trains/others mags. I haven't seen anything about this at all and wonder if it really happened. Sorry for the doubt. Bob ... Get your grubby hands off my tagline! I stole it first! --- D'B 3000A3/GoldED/386 3.00.Alpha5+REG#1047/TAG 2.7c Beta * Origin: The Oak Tree BBS, Ozark, MO., 417-581-0868 (1:284/11) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 147 RAILROAD FANS Ref: EEW00002 Date: 10/26/97 From: BOB WINGENDER Time: 09:23pm \/To: BOB WALLACE (Read 0 times) Subj: iron horses Hello Bob. Saturday October 25 1997 11:36, Bob Wallace wrote to Bob Wingender: BW> Hi, Bob. BW>> Was trying to remember the "Wasatch Range" in last message but ouldn't. BW>> Sti wouldn't be as big a territory that the Challenger can go. Just try BW>> to visualize 1 more driver on each engine and you'll have a "BIG BOY". BW>> :) (I kn still not the same). BW> Not a problem for the Big Boys to work themselves through the BW> Wasatch. BW> They're nothing more than a pair of Northern-class engines tied to a BW> single frame, albeit with a pivot point under the front section of the BW> boiler for the first set of four drivers. That's not the point as they were built for the Wasatch. It's the other places they *weren't* built for. And a doubled set of Northerns are stretched out far enough that the shorter radius curves make no difference. The coupling is very different than a Big Boy pivot point as the only 'engine' that really pivots on the BB is the front one. BW>> Think I've got that but I remember seeing the smaller engines of BW>> 'Frisco' pu 100+ cars when I was growing up beside the BW>> Springfield-Memphis mainline. BW> Recall that just west of the Cheyenne freight yard, the U.P.'s main BW> starts up a grade on its way to the summit of Sherman Hill, something BW> like 25 miles west of Cheyenne? What the U.P. did with their large BW> engines was to stop for water some part of the way up Sherman, including BW> cutting off the lead engine on a two-engine "lead" at the front of BW> trains, and stop to allow any helper on the rear to water up, too. BW> Imagine the fun of having to spot two or three Challengers or Big Boys BW> under the water tank each and every trip over that hill!? Not quite BW> like parking one's car at the gas station pump. Well, for the most part, the trains were made up to use just one BB but it was not uncommon to find doubled BB's or with other power as helpers. I think the watering 'hole' was about 2/3rds up the hill, wasn't it? BW>> It is mentioned in several movies I have that "The BigBoy could pull BW>> a train miles long on level track". Would love to have seen that! BW>> And I believe that would be more than 100 cars, right? BW> Given something on the order of 4,000 horsepower in each of the Big BW> Boys, highly likely. Not too shabby for a museum piece! There's one at St. Louis I've been meaning to go see. I went to Omaha and was able to see 4023 at the shop area, using a visitors pass, to get inside the chain linked fence area. Now, it's sitting in Kinnifick(sp) park at the exit going to the airport. With it is a 6900 series Big D. Need to get up there again. Had a rented camcorder but the battery went down too fast with no spare. :( Take care. Bob ... Dan Quayle thinks that Cheerios are donut seeds. --- D'B 3000A3/GoldED/386 3.00.Alpha5+REG#1047/TAG 2.7c Beta * Origin: The Oak Tree BBS, Ozark, MO., 417-581-0868 (1:284/11)