--------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 142 AUTO RACING Ref: DAC00053 Date: 06/06/96 From: CONRAD SIAO Time: 09:23pm \/To: CHRIS OGNIBEN (Read 6 times) Subj: Re: HEWITT CO> CART racing will continue and do well that the only thing different for CO> them is racing at Michigan instead of Indy from now on. And the rule CO> changes which are pretty cool and gave Andretti the win yesterday for CO> the Miller 200. I just hope that this fued with CART and IRL is not CO> going to last for a long time. Well put. BTW, if this battle continues to happen, the US 500 could be held at the new CALIFORNIA SPEEDWAY that is currently being built in Southern California. The CA Speedway is a 2.0 mile oval that I believe is owned by Roger Penske... Conrad Siao Go Honda! --- GEcho 1.00 * Origin: No Such Luck BBS San Diego,CA 619-583-5379 (1:202/810) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 142 AUTO RACING Ref: DAC00054 Date: 06/06/96 From: BRIAN HOILMAN Time: 7:12:am \/To: JOHN STEINMAN (Read 6 times) Subj: N. Wilksboro RW>Hello John. RW>02 Jun 96 20:53, John Steinman wrote to Roy Witt: RW> JS> * Forwarded from area 'AUTORACE > JS> > JS> Why do you seem to think the statement I made about R.Wallace > JS> is a flame? I am only stateing the facts. Sometimes the truth > JS> hurts. Anyways, just the other week allmost all the teams in WC > JS> where fined for some sort of illegal door brace. Somepart of the > JS> frame and cage. So where is the Flamming at???? RW>Ya got me! I just pointed out to the asker (B) which part was flame... RW>... Safe sex means never having to say, "You've got WHAT!?" >--- > * Origin: * Bow Tie Racers, #1 On or Off the Track * (1:202/909.13) From my past experiences of posting in this echo, putting down on any driver is supposed to be "flaming". AND, saying that Rusty was "cheating" is NOT A FACT and according to the echo guidelines set by the moderator, saying that he was cheating is "flaming". But, I'm beginning to think that only applies if your saying something bad about Earnhardt. --- QMPro 1.52 He does the work of 3 Men...Moe, Larry & Curly --- EXCELSIOR! 1.21K; XMAIL! 1.90 * Origin: The Holler BBS (1:3666/114.0) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 142 AUTO RACING Ref: DAC00055 Date: 06/06/96 From: PETER CURLE Time: 11:20pm \/To: ALL (Read 6 times) Subj: Formula 1 ******************** (-: Formula 1 NEWS :-) ******************** The Electronic Formula 1 News Service for the Internet World Wide Web server at http://www.enigmatic.co.uk/formula1 *** June 5th 1996 *** *** Issue Number 29 *** **************************************************************** In This Issue *New Sponsor For Forti *Improved Renault Engine For France *Improved Honda Engine For France *More Races Next Season ? *Chinese GP *Brundle To Quit ? *Magnussen To Go To Stewart GP ? *Barcelona Review *Championship Standings *Coulthard Staying At McLaren *Web Site Update / News Back Issues *The Best Driver Ever? Jochen Rindt New Sponsor For Forti Forti have signed a new sponsorship deal with Shannon Racing which will see the famous Yellow cars replaced with Green and White ones. Yellow has been a bad luck colour for cars in Formula1, with only Lotus scoring a GP win in an all yellow car in recent years (Senna 1987 Monaco and US). Perhaps the change of colour will bring a change of fortune........ Forti also stayed on at Catalunya to test aerodynamic modifications to their cars, wind tunnel sessions should see the finished results ready for the French GP. Improved Renault Engine For France Renault have been under increasing criticism lately for the performance of their engines. The failure of Hill's engine in Monaco followed by the failure in testing was compounded by Villeneuve's engine failure during practice at Barcelona. The Renault engine is still the most complete package in Formula1 and the failures though close together are not related. Hill's oil pump caused his engine to blow at Monaco. The Silverstone engine was a development model, these are expected to fail and Bernard Dudot said "They have to (fail) if you are to learn anything". The engine which failed on Jacques was a slightly tweaked version and Renault are investigating the failure. The next evolution of the RS8 is scheduled to appear in the French GP, though it may be ready in time for Canada. This is expected to offer increased performance without compromising reliability. (Just what the other teams wanted to hear!) Improved Honda Engine For France Ligier will also be sporting a new engine for the French GP, this will deliver more power and Honda are expected to have the engine ready for Canada. This should aid Panis in his quest for points. More Races Next Season ? Speculation that there could be as many as 18 races next year have been rubbished by Ron Dennis. He said that the teams were all keen to reduce costs and cited the 1997 Concord agreement which has signed for 16 races. He added "We don't need more races, 16 are quite enough" Chinese GP The possibilities of a GP in China look more likely. Present at the Spanish GP were a delegation of the Chinese Motor Sports Federation. It is assumed that they were looking at how the GP was organised in preparation of hosting a race in the near future. Brundle To Quit ? There have been rumours that Martin Brundle would quit F1 at the end of the year. Many people have been surprised by the news, none more than Martin himself who dismissed the rumours. Magnussen To Go To Stewart GP ? Jan Magnussen the McLaren test driver is said to be close to finalising a deal with Stewart GP to drive for the team next year. Magnussen the British Formula3 champion in 1994 is currently driving in the ITC championships. Barcelona Review The Spanish GP was run in some of the worst weather I can remember, so poor was visibility that confusion about the race reigned long after it had finished. The conditions lead to a start line incident which saw Coulthard, Lamy, Fisichella and Rosset all collide at the start, Fisichella limped round to the pits and retired, Panis spun into a wall and Irvine spun out and got stuck on the grass. Less than two laps run and already the field had been reduced to 14 cars. Like Monaco two weeks earlier the rate of retirements was extraordinary, the two Jordan's both retired with differential problems on lap 17 for Brundle and lap 45 for Barrichello. Apart from Katayama (electrical problems) and Mika Salo (black flag for using the spare car) all the other retirements were due to spins. Hill, Herbert, Berger, and Verstappen all leaving the circuit for good. While at the front Michael Schumacher in the Ferrari V10....V9...V8...V10 again! was giving a demonstration of wet weather car control, lapping up to 4 seconds faster than the rest of the field and seemingly powersliding through corners just for the fun of it. His overtaking of Alesi and Villeneuve was copy book stuff and the Ferrari team will be on a huge high going to Canada. Alesi struggled with a poor set up, but managed to drive a fine race finishing second ahead of a much improved Villeneuve. Each wet race sees improvements from the young Canadian. Sauber, McLaren and Ligier all scored points again, though all the cars were at least 1 lap down. Pos Driver Team Time 1 M. Schumacher Ferrari 1.59.49.307 2 J. Alesi Benetton +45.302 3 J. Villeneuve Williams +48.388 4 H. H. Frentzen Sauber +1 lap 5 M. Hakkinen McLaren +1 lap 6 P. Diniz Ligier +2 laps Retirements J. Verstappen TWR Arrows Spin 47 R. Barrichello Jordan Differential 45 G. Berger Benetton Spin 44 J. Herbert Sauber Spin 20 M. Brundle Jordan Differential 17 M. Salo Tyrrell Black Flag 16 D. Hill Williams Spin 10 U. Katayama Tyrrell Electrical 8 E. Irvine Ferrari Spin 1 O. Panis Ligier Collision damage 1 G. Fisichella Minardi Collision damage 1 D. Coulthard McLaren Collision 0 P. Lamy Minardi Collision 0 R. Rosset TWR Arrows Collision 0 DNQ L. Badoer Forti A. Montermini Forti Championship Standings Drivers 1 D. Hill Williams Renault 43 2 J. Villeneuve Williams Renault 26 2 M. Schumacher Ferrari 26 4 J. Alesi Benetton Renault 17 5 O. Panis Ligier Mugen Honda 11 6 D. Coulthard McLaren Mercedes 10 7 E. Irvine Ferrari 9 8 M. Hakkinen McLaren Mercedes 8 9 R. Barrichello Jordan Peugeot 7 9 G. Berger Benetton Renault 7 11 H. H. Frentzen Sauber Ford 6 12 M.Salo Tyrrell Yamaha 5 13 J. Herbert Sauber Ford 4 14 M. Brundle Jordan Peugeot 1 14 J. Verstappen Arrows Hart 1 14 P. Diniz Ligier Mugen Honda 1 Constructors 1 Williams Renault 69 2 Ferrari 35 3 Benetton Renault 24 4 McLaren Mercedes 18 5 Ligier Mugen Honda 12 6 Sauber Ford 10 7 Jordan Peugeot 8 8 Tyrrell Yamaha 5 9 Arrows Hart 1 Coulthard Staying At McLaren David Coulthard will not be moving to the new Stewart racing team, as had been rumoured. His manager said that he wanted to stay at McLaren for the next year as David believes that they are on the verge of great things again. He also denied that McLaren had offered the young Scot another 3 million pounds to stay. Web Site Update / News Back Issues We are getting so many requests for back issues of Formula1 News that we can't cope any more. So we will be setting up an FTP archive for back issues. The address will be the same, but use ftp instead of www. (So ftp.u-net.com/enigma/formula1 should do the trick ). There will be an FTP page added to the web site too, so that you can get the files from there using your web browser. We will add the index of articles under each issue on the web page so that you can be sure which ones you need. Also our brand new (oh it's so shiny !) server is almost in place. We would be honoured (if you get the chance) if you would have a look and give it some traffic to test that it works. The whole site has been transferred and we want to make sure the site works as it does now before we implement new features. The address for the new server is http://www.enigmatic.co.uk/formula1. The Best Driver Ever? No 12. Jochen Rindt Jochen Rindt will sadly be remembered by most people as Formula1's only posthumous World Champion. I hope that this short article will highlight some of the immense talent that was lost that tragic day at Monza. Jochen's debut in the 1964 Austrian GP was not spectacular, his Brabham BT11 BRM retired with steering problems. That was his only race that year For 1965 he had a full time drive in the Cooper team. 4th in Germany and 6th in the US were his first points enough for him to finish 13th in the championship. He stayed with Cooper for 1966, the team had replaced the Climax engines with Maserati and Rindt scored points every time he finished. Three podium finishes were enough to see him finish third in the championship. 1967 was a poor year, the car that had served him well in 1966 let him down eight times. The two races that he finished (Belgium and Italy) both gave him points, but not enough. Jochen joined Brabham in 1968, Brabham were the constructors title winners in 1967 and so this looked like a good move. Sadly in Formula1 things move very quickly and the Brabham cars were not reliable enough. In a season that was similar to 1967 Jochen scored two results (both 3rd) in South Africa and Germany. He also scored his first pole positions in France and Canada. The other races all saw him retire. Colin Chapman offered a Lotus drive for 1969 and Jochen accepted. He qualified on the front row in his first race, though he retired due to a faulty fuel pump. The next two races saw him qualify on pole only to retire. Retirements were beginning to get Jochen down and he was looking to move teams again. Chapman persuaded him to stay with the promise of number 1 status in the team and the new Lotus 72 which would make all the other cars look obsolete. Jochen agreed to stay and in the second half of the 1969 season he gained three podium finishes. The race at Watkins Glen was his first GP win, he had started from pole, set the fastest lap and this time his car had lasted. He had out driven the rest of Formula1, something he had done before, but this time he was rewarded for it. He finished fourth in the championship. In 1970 Colin Chapman delivered his promises, the Lotus 72 was indeed an incredible car, one which would still be winning races in 1974. Jochen won his first race in Monaco, ironically in the old Lotus 49. A retirement in Belgium was followed with wins in Holland, France, Britain and Germany and a retirement in Austria. His final GP was the 1970 Italian race at Monza, rumours of Rindt retiring were rife as his close friends Piers Courage and Bruce McLaren had been killed in the proceeding months, but he decided to race on. He was killed when his Lotus lost control due to mechanical failure, it veered into the barrier at high speed completely destroying the front of the car. Jochen was pronounced dead on arrival at a Milan hospital. The title then became a race between Jacky Ickx, Denny Hulme and Clay Regazzoni. Regazzoni won in Italy, Ickx won in Canada and Mexico, but a surprise win in the US GP by Lotus team mate Emerson Fittipaldi made it impossible for Jochen's total to be overtaken and he became the first and only (thankfully) posthumous World champion. Jochen was one of those rare drivers that could bring a race to life, he loved to race and in many ways he and Gilles Villeneuve were from the same mould. Winning in cars that shouldn't even be in the points let alone leading a GP. 60 races, 6 wins, 10 poles and 3 fastest laps . Sometimes statistics can hide talent, like that of Rindt. Let down by mechanical failure over 35 times he would undoubtedly have been a multiple world champion were it not for poor reliability and that fatal accident at Monza. Copyright June 1996 Formula 1 News Check out our Web Site at: http://www.u-net.com/enigma/formula1 http://www.enigmatic.co.uk/formula1 Updated news available from the home page. ---------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe send e-mail with "Unsubscribe F1" in the body to F1Admin@bigvern.demon.co.uk ---------------------------------------------------------------- This document is most definitely Copyright June 1996 Formula 1 News. This publication is free for the Internet community and may be freely distributed to news groups and forums provided it is reposted completely, in a wholly unedited form complete with this copyright notice and credited to Neil Whiley. None of these articles are guaranteed 100% true, accurate or correct. We report it as we hear it. In many cases one weeks story will be completely contradicted by next weeks, such is life :-) Formula 1 News is written and edited by Neil Whiley at Enigma Electronic Publishing (Neil@bigvern.demon.co.uk). Neil Neil Whiley The Formula1 Web Site(s) http://www.u-net.com/enigma/formula1 (The Original) http://www.enigmatic.co.uk/formula1 (Testing Now) The most comprehensive Formula1 site on the net. News, Reviews, Results, Reports, Statistics, Histories, Records, Rules, Regulations and TV Schedules. Over 760 pages of F1. ___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.20 [NR] --- PCBoard (R) v15.22/100 * Origin: (1:3615/51) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 142 AUTO RACING Ref: DAC00056 Date: 06/06/96 From: DAVE DRUM Time: 08:23pm \/To: JOHN GROVE (Read 6 times) Subj: random thoughts redux I'm gonna respond to your carefully chosen quotes here John. You must have been paying close attention during the classes on yellow journalism and how to slant stories while appearing even-handed.... B^)= JG> "To have a totally oval series you would have to go back to the JG> fifties. Why would we want to go back to the fifties? Times have JG> changed". Mario Andretti. Yep! They have changed. Whether for good or bad is open to question. But then life is a succession of changes. When things stop changing they are dead. What is Mario's point? Other than belaboring the obvious. JG> "We're being shut out of Indianapolis. We have twenty six or JG> twenty seven drivers here and only eight of them would have been JG> allowed to run Indy". Paul Neuman. This is false to fact... Any CART team or driver could have run Mickey World or Phoenix to pick up enough points to get an "earned" spot in the 500. In fact, according to one of my sources TG and Roger had a deal worked out to start 42 cars in the 500. But the other CART denizens (Karl the See Gar and Pat Patrick and L'il Andy Craig) got their backs arched up and wouldn't allow it. JG> "On a per race basis it won't be much cheaper than CART". John JG> DelaPena. I see. And he has a crystal ball with fine tune controls??? JG> "I promise you, if Mario thought the IRL was best for racing, JG> he'd be sitting down there right now". Paul Neuman. No, he'd be where his contract told him to be. Mario knows which side of his butter pays the bread. JG> "I don't think there will ever be an accord whereby CART comes JG> back to Indianapolis". Toney George OK, that's Toney George. What does Tony George think about the situation? JG> "Roger Penski is painted as the boggy man in this thing. Some JG> places you read that he's the one pulling all the strings. But the JG> reality is the nineteen owners are fully in accord on their feelings JG> for what this sport needs to have to go forward in the future". JG> Bobby Rahal. Nice spelling there.... I always thought Roger spelled his name Penske. That's the way it looks on the trucks, anyway. See my comment above about RP being a villian. Lot of people maneuvering behind the scenes and letting Roger take the heat for their backstabbing and Machievellian tactics. Unfortunately justice is so arranged that people like this seldom get what they deserve. JG> "If you have the greatest spectacle in racing you deserve to JG> have the best race and this year thats not what they have". David JG> Letterman. That's a matter of opinion. The 500 was a better race than the Michigan crashfest... IMO. But, in a way Letterman is right. That first lap Vasser caused crash was a great spectacle at a race track. JG> "If you want to talk about cutting costs in racing, a third of JG> the budget is spent at Indianapolis for the three weeks there". JG> Rick Mears. Yes, and tell the rest of the story, Rick. One third of the budget and over half of the exposure for the year in those weeks. Looks a little different viewed from that perspective. JG> "Tradition is important and its worth something but it has to JG> be a valid tradition. It has to be tradition that has continuity. JG> The Indianapolis Motor Speedway made a decision about its qualifying JG> and they cut the tradition. They cut its head off. When you cut JG> the head off, its dead" according to the director of marketing for JG> Mercedes. I refer the director to my comments about Pauly Neuman's blatherings. Is Paul any relation to Alfred E.? JG> It's interesting to note that, by the time IRL races again at JG> New Hampshire, cart will have run its eighth race since Memorial JG> Day. Your point is? They are two different series. I notice that IRL doesn't have any trouble fillling its fields. And I also noted that CART could only muster 27 starters (before they were Vasserized) for the Michigan race. But, then, short fields are nothing new to CART. ENJOY!!! Something's Cooking in Uncle Dirty Dave's Kitchen ... It's pretty much human nature to compete. Joe Norris, Nov. 94 --- PCBoard (R) v15.21/M 10 * Origin: Fantasy Land BBS * Springfield, IL * (217)535-1005 (1:2430/2) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 142 AUTO RACING Ref: DAC00057 Date: 06/07/96 From: DAVE DRUM Time: 07:00am \/To: FRED FINDLING (Read 6 times) Subj: Re: Random thoughts FF> The IRL may never have any Andretti's or Unser's around, but I think FF> it is perfectly capable of creating its own stars. Lazier may have been FF> the first, but the Ritchie Hearns and Billy Boats aren't far behind! All FF> this is not lost on potential promoters and I think Tony G. will have FF> litte trouble filling out the IRL schedule for next year. Media coverage FF> will be there and the big name sponsors will certainly follow. FF> I think Ron Hemelgarn will sleep content knowing that his future in FF> Indy Car racing is quite secure!! At last, someone besides Max and me who doesn't subscribe to the Chicken Little school of Indy Car prognosticating. In a way I am somewhat embarrassed. I have always prided myself on being able to put my ideas across to anyone, even the dullest dolt on the face of the planet. I have even made a living doing that whilst employed by various newspapers and broadcast mediums. Not that this was ever a contest but you have bested me, sir, in the effort to put the IRL situation in a clear concise summation. My hat is off to you. And thanks for your thoughts. ENJOY!!! Something's Cooking in Uncle Dirty Dave's Kitchen ... "We were all just racers. All we wanted to do was race." John Rutherford --- PCBoard (R) v15.21/M 10 * Origin: Fantasy Land BBS * Springfield, IL * (217)535-1005 (1:2430/2) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 142 AUTO RACING Ref: DAC00058 Date: 06/07/96 From: DAVE DRUM Time: 07:09am \/To: RICK PALI (Read 6 times) Subj: Ford vs Chevy vs STOCK? RH> Except that a Ford is the only thing that runs clsoe to stock RH> configuration. THe Tbirds still are rear wheel drive. RP> That's a point, but it hardly qualifies a Ford NASCAR racer as *close* RP> to stock. Lets see how a stock Ford runs after touching 9000rpm... :-) Can you even get a V8 in any of the GM body styles legal to run in NASCAR? I think not... but I could be wrong. Let's see someone turn a smallblock GM V8 at 9 grand fresh out of Mr. Goodwrench's crate. Same result as you imply (correctly) for the Ford - POOF! We know they ain't stock. So, lets drop this my brand can whup your brand since if NASCAR rides were branded they would be Banjo, or Pistone, or Penske, or Cotton's, or Yates, or.... Let's get back to ABE vs DEIG wars instead. ENJOY!!! Something's Cooking in Uncle Dirty Dave's Kitchen ... I am NOT Paranoid! And why are you always watching me?? --- PCBoard (R) v15.21/M 10 * Origin: Fantasy Land BBS * Springfield, IL * (217)535-1005 (1:2430/2) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 142 AUTO RACING Ref: DAC00059 Date: 06/05/96 From: JOE NORRIS Time: 07:55pm \/To: MARTIN VINCENT (Read 6 times) Subj: Kyle Petty Hi Martin, -=> Quoting Martin Vincent to Joe Norris <=- MV> I think 5 laps was right because the contact was blatant, MV> you just don't try to make it three-wide in the dogleg at MV> Charlotte..... Sounds good to me! BTW, I appreciate the other notes you've posted on this subject, as it verifies my recollection of the incident. That being that Ted was a lap down, and not on the lead lap as one fellow posted to me. Thanks for the backup!! Joe Norris -=- Blue Wave/QWK v2.12 --- SLMAIL v4.5a (#4185) * Origin: Rapid River BBS 715-435-3855 (1:238/350) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 142 AUTO RACING Ref: DAC00060 Date: 06/05/96 From: JOE NORRIS Time: 08:02pm \/To: MAX LAKE (Read 6 times) Subj: Moore vs Fittapaldi Joe Norris said... JN> ....I'd be watching hockey!! -=> Quoting Max Lake to Joe Norris <=- ML> SO do you feel C. Fittipaldi should have been penalized ML> for cross checking for the accident, or given a game ML> misconduct for taking a poke at Moore? Hi Max, For the accident, I'd give CF a two minute minor for "boarding". And for the after-accident antics, I'd give him a two minute "instigator" penalty, and a game misconduct for un-sportsmanlike conduct!! Joe -=- Blue Wave/QWK v2.12 --- SLMAIL v4.5a (#4185) * Origin: Rapid River BBS 715-435-3855 (1:238/350)