--------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 129 OP. SYS DEBATE Ref: E4A00000Date: 04/03/97 From: ALLAN ANDERSON Time: 09:15am \/To: SCOTT LITTLE (Read 2 times) Subj: Which is the best? -=> Quoting Scott Little to Brandon Pen <=- SL> [ Quoting Brandon Pen to All ] BP> Hello. What operating do you think is the best? Please tell me, I SL> Win95 suits the masses quite well. OS2 is more stable (usually), SL> multitasks better than Win95 (again, usually) than Win95, but OS2 is SL> not a home OS as Win95 is, OS2 compares more to WinNT. OS2 also doesn't SL> do all the new software and games being released. So unless you are SL> going to use OS2 as, say a network server of some type, where it will SL> sit in the corner and be covered with junk, don't use it. I agree here. I ran OS/2 2.1 and Warp. Just recently converted to Wn95. I did this because of the type of software that I need to run. SL> The main problem I have with OS2 is it's lack of SL> up-to-date/with-the-times software. The word processors are still in SL> the 80's, the HTML editors are still in the v2 stage, there isn't a SL> decent game in sight, the CAD/design apps are OK, but still not up to SL> scratch... the list goes on. SL> If you are seriously deciding, take a look at some people with OS2 and SL> Win95 (and maybe NT) machines set up at home. Pick the one that does SL> everything you want it to do, and the one you like using more. OS/2 is a good business system, but the average person won't need it's power. I also found that both systems will hang the system. I got real good at crashing Warp, in fact I could do it daily (especially with TCP/IP). Win95, on the other hand, doesn't require as much, for me, to get my system back up and running after a program crashes. I still like OS/2, but made the switch for software compatability reasons. ... DOS never says "EXCELLENT command or filename"... --- Blue Wave/386 v2.30 [NR] * Origin: MACH2/VULCAN OS/2 SYSTEMS 1-403-489-4250 (1:342/61) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 129 OP. SYS DEBATE Ref: E4A00001Date: 04/04/97 From: DENIS TONN Time: 01:43pm \/To: SCOTT LITTLE (Read 2 times) Subj: Which is the best? Original from Scott Little to Justin Baustert on 04-02-1997 Original Subject: Which is the best? --------------------------------------- SL> Funny, one of the programs I use was written by an OS2 fan, but since he SL> couldn't get his hands on a OS2 compiler for a reasonable price (he's not SL> a professional programmer so buying a new package is a waste) he compiled it SL> with a >free< Win32s compiler. How's that for OS2 support eh :) Point him at the OS/2 GNU compiler(s). Same price as above. How's that for really knowing what is available, eh? JB> finding that software, but you just have to know where to look.. SL> You also need to know how to extract blood from a stone. Or know how to use an internet search facility, or a BBS files search facility. I will admit that OS/2 users don't get the software shoved in their faces as much as Windows users do, nor does the average "Window's weenie" salesman know that any other software exists. But there *is* software out there. Reliable, inexpensive (vs cheap) software from a multitude of sources. Denis All opinions are my very own, IBM has no claim upon them . . . --- Maximus/2 3.01 * Origin: T-Board - (604) 277-4574 (1:153/908) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 129 OP. SYS DEBATE Ref: E4A00002Date: 04/05/97 From: MACK BARSS Time: 03:19pm \/To: SCOTT LITTLE (Read 2 times) Subj: Test Results Scott Little wrote in a message to Mike Ruskai: SL> BTW, FAT32 is Win95 only. It doesn't work under MSDOS7. I assume SL> either DOS7 is (mostly) non-existant under FAT32, or FAT32 is truely a SL> complete IFS for Win95. MR> Nonsense. IO.SYS was kludged to support it as well. If not, they'd MR> break over 80% of the "compatibility" Win95 has with ill-behaved DOS MR> programs. SL> IO.SYS was modified so that it could find the files needed to boot SL> Windows. You cannot run the PC in MSDOS mode with FAT32, so IO.SYS SL> doesn't contain the full file system. Scott.. Got news for you SAM mode is MS-DOS... booting to the command prompt is MSDOS mode. Face it... you CAN run the PC in MSDOS mode with FAT32. IO.SYS that comes with OSR supports both VFAT and FAT32. Are you implying that Win95B doesn't support SAM mode... thats funny.. but Microsoft still includes the option "Restart computer in MS-DOS mode" as an option on the Shutdown menu. Win95B still supports SAM mode. => Mack <= --- timEd/2 1.10 * Origin: Modem Connections/2 (613) 820-2594 - Nepean, Ont. (1:163/545) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 129 OP. SYS DEBATE Ref: E4A00003Date: 04/05/97 From: MACK BARSS Time: 03:27pm \/To: SCOTT LITTLE (Read 2 times) Subj: Test Results Scott Little wrote in a message to Mack Barss: MB> to use FAT32 with Win95B you have to FDISK the drive. Funny... but MB> NTFS and HPFS doesn't require you to run FDISK to use them. SL> They require a full format don't they? What's the difference? Not SL> much. FDISK and Change partition type to FAT32 is not rocket SL> science. You don't need to modify the partitions either. That's all they require Scott... you can format a FAT partition as HPFS or NTFS. You can not format a FAT/VFAT partition as FAT32. The FORMAT command for Win95B doesn't even have options for selecting a format of FAT/VFAT or FAT32. Format will format the drive FAT if you didn't use FDISK to put it in FAT32 mode.. and if you use large harddrive support, it would format it as FAT32. And your wrong about modifiy partitions. Switch from FAT to FAT32 is modifying the partition... you have to FORMAT after doing the switch. MB> So.. FAT32 is not turely an IFS. Lets set... say you have a drive MB> already formated as FAT ... now install NT ... you can install NTFS as SL> Lets switch. Lets install Warp on a FAT16 drive. Hmm... almost the SL> exact same thing, except the format doesn't change the partition SL> type, FDISK does. Format formats according to the FDISK setting. So would you care to explain your comment above about not modifying the partitions? Funny... chaning the file type from type A to TYPE B is modifying the partition. In order to use FAT32 ... you have to run BOTH FDISK and FORMAT. MB> Oh.. and for your information Scott... Microsoft states that you can MB> not disable VFAT support for Windows 95. SL> The resource kit specifically states it can be disabled. I think SL> you were looking at the same info that states Win95's cache can't SL> be set to a specific size, which of course it can, MS just tell SL> everyone it can't to stop them stuffing their system. Guess you don't get the updates for the Windows 95 Resource KIT do you Scott. Please provide the proof that Microsoft states that VFAT can be disabled... every try loading Windows 95 with out the VFAT drivers? Now you wouldn't be refering to turning off VFAT by telling it to use the Windows 3.1 file system now would you Scott? Maybe you should get the "List of Documentation Errors in Windows 95 Resource Kit". The PSS ID number is Q135849 - dated 09-12-1996 ... and it states: Page 689: Turning Off the Extended File System Features Online Help: Technical Notes on Long Filenames ------------------------------------------------------- The "Turning off the extended file system features" and "To enable the Windows 3.1 file system" sections are invalid because Windows 95 does not support this. For example, if you edited the registry to include the Win31FileSystem key, Windows 95 would ignored it. Microsoft states your Resource Kit. So Scott.. since Win95 ignores the Win31FileSystem key tell us how you turn off VFAT support under Windows 95. No VFAT... no Windows 95. MB> enable "large hard drive support" .. they should have had FDISK ask MB> straight out "do you want to enable FAT32 support". SL> MS have to deal with the point-n-click happy crowd. Since the only SL> people using OS2 are the die hard lab rats, it's not a problem to SL> use technical terms. But MS have to deal with the majority of the SL> market, which wouldn't have the foggiest what FAT32 is. Simple way SL> out is to call it Large Drive Support. Must be the same majority who think you can turn off VFAT in Win95. => Mack <= --- timEd/2 1.10 * Origin: Modem Connections/2 (613) 820-2594 - Nepean, Ont. (1:163/545) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 129 OP. SYS DEBATE Ref: E4A00004Date: 04/05/97 From: GORD MCFEE Time: 05:28pm \/To: SCOTT LITTLE (Read 2 times) Subj: Anyone Heard This Story? In a message dated 04-02-97, Scott Little said to Frank Sexton: SL> [ Quoting Frank Sexton to All ] FS> Why on EARTH do you suppose that whenever Windows95 FS> "messes-up", users AUTOMATICALLY assume that they did FS> something wrong? And when OS/2 messes-up they say FS> something like "OS/2 messed-up my system". SL>OS2 is just so perfect that it couldn't possibly have let an SL>insignificant user stuff it up, could it? Very well put. You are exactly right. SL>But then, if it's so perfect, OS2 can't stuff up either?! Oh, I get it, SL>the HARDWARE is bad. We'll all have to go out and buy hardware to suit SL>our operating system. And you complain MS makes us do things the MS SL>way! IBM makes me go out and buy all new hardware. Why do they do it to you and not to me? I've been using the same hardware for a long time now and IBM never made me buy any new stuff. Gord McFee ___ * MR/2 2.26 #331 * I'll write no line before its time (gmcfee@ibm.net) --- Maximus/2 3.01 * Origin: Modem Connections/2 - (613) 820-2594 - Nepean, Ont. (1:163/545) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 129 OP. SYS DEBATE Ref: E4A00005Date: 04/05/97 From: GORD MCFEE Time: 05:32pm \/To: ALL (Read 2 times) Subj: I'M Back! Just a short note to let you know that I am back in this conference. It's been a while and I promise to mainly lurk for a while until I have caught up with the "debates". Hope everyone is well and if anyone would like to drop me an e-mail at my address below, and let me know what's up, I would be pleased. Gord McFee ___ * MR/2 2.26 #331 * I'll write no line before its time (gmcfee@ibm.net) --- Maximus/2 3.01 * Origin: Modem Connections/2 - (613) 820-2594 - Nepean, Ont. (1:163/545) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 129 OP. SYS DEBATE Ref: E4A00006Date: 04/05/97 From: GORD MCFEE Time: 05:33pm \/To: JACK STEIN (Read 2 times) Subj: Dbat Babble March Part 1 In a message dated 04-01-97, Jack Stein said to All: JS> Part 1 JS> The OS/2 REXX BabbloMeter Report JS> Monthly Babble received in OS-DEBAT at Jack's Free Lunch BBS JS> March, 1997 JS> 57 users babbled 320 Messages How are you doing, Jack? The volume seems to be way down over what I remember, but that may be a good thing. :-) [rest deleted] Gord McFee ___ * MR/2 2.26 #331 * I'll write no line before its time (gmcfee@ibm.net) --- Maximus/2 3.01 * Origin: Modem Connections/2 - (613) 820-2594 - Nepean, Ont. (1:163/545) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 129 OP. SYS DEBATE Ref: E4A00007Date: 04/05/97 From: GORD MCFEE Time: 05:43pm \/To: SCOTT LITTLE (Read 2 times) Subj: Which Is The Best? In a message dated 03-30-97, Scott Little said to Brandon Pen: SL> [ Quoting Brandon Pen to All ] BP> Hello. What operating do you think is the best? Please tell me, I SL>Woah, you're in the wrong echo :) You're going to get a barrage of SL>biased opinions are very little fact and truth in reply to your SL>message. You have to admit that a barrage of "biased opinions" in an OS *debate* echo is not all that surprising. :-) BP> would like to try a few out. I think that Windows 95 is the best, not BP> only because it is a good system, but also because it comes with DOS SL>Win95 suits the masses quite well. OS2 is more stable (usually), SL>multitasks better than Win95 (again, usually) than Win95, but OS2 is SL>not a home OS as Win95 is, OS2 compares more to WinNT. OS2 also doesn't SL>do all the new software and games being released. So unless you are SL>going to use OS2 as, say a network server of some type, where it will SL>sit in the corner and be covered with junk, don't use it. Thank God you didn't succumb to the temptation to blast forth a "barrage of biased opinions". :-) SL>The main problem I have with OS2 is it's lack of SL>up-to-date/with-the-times software. The word processors are still in SL>the 80's, the HTML editors are still in the v2 stage, there isn't a SL>decent game in sight, the CAD/design apps are OK, but still not up to SL>scratch... the list goes on. This has an element of truth in it, but ignores the fact that OS/2 will run all that up to date software. SL>If you are seriously deciding, take a look at some people with OS2 and SL>Win95 (and maybe NT) machines set up at home. Pick the one that does SL>everything you want it to do, and the one you like using more. This I agree with. Gord McFee ___ * MR/2 2.26 #331 * I'll write no line before its time (gmcfee@ibm.net) --- Maximus/2 3.01 * Origin: Modem Connections/2 - (613) 820-2594 - Nepean, Ont. (1:163/545)