--------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DCX00017 Date: 08/26/96 From: MATT SMITH Time: 10:50pm \/To: PAUL SAYAN (Read 3 times) Subj: Re: Vouchers PS> RM> But does this mean: PS> RM> A) The teaching is better PS> RM> B) Private schools are better PS> RM> C) The learning "atmosphere" is better in a private school PS> RM> My guess is "C".... Now if we could just get the gutless PS> RM> politicians and administrators to impose some discipline in PS> RM> public schools, and perhaps write off problem students, PS> RM> maybe we could improve things..... PS> PS> The results of my masters' project would give evidence to PS> that PS> theory. The needs to be a study of the public schools, or the PS> schools PS> had to take the behavior problem students and see how those grades PS> did. PS> If you average out the two scores and there is no significant PS> difference then the schools should report that there is no PS> difference. PS> During my project, I raised scores by 2.2 points by simply PS> removing students who saw the school pychologist, or who saw the PS> intervention team. But until public schools are allowed to remove troublemakers from the classroom, private schools will be the only alternative parents demanding that their kid's education not be ruined have. That's why vouchers are needed. --- Simplex BBS (v1.07.00Beta [DOS]) * Origin: NighthawkBBS, Burlington NC 910-228-7002 HST Dual (1:3644/6) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DCX00018 Date: 08/26/96 From: CHARLIE WATERS Time: 10:15pm \/To: ALL (Read 2 times) Subj: This ECHO is Now Available Here Greetings, All.. Just a quick note to let everyone know that this ECHO is now being carried by The NeverEnding BBS located in Deltona, Florida, USA. Give us a call at (904) 789-8383 or via telnet at bbs.neverending.com Access is FREE, All PUBLIC FIDO Access is Free. Stop by and take part in your favorite Fido Net Echos. Thanks for your time. Charlie Charlie Waters --- Platinum Xpress/Win/Wildcat5! v2.0GG * Origin: The NeverEnding BBS, Deltona FL, (904) 789-8383 (1:3618/555) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DCY00000 Date: 08/27/96 From: SHEILA KING Time: 05:17pm \/To: CHARLES BEAMS (Read 3 times) Subj: Blackboard Bungle 4 Regarding the California Reading Framework: -> "I don't mean to be defensive about the framework, but it was a -> philosophical document," says Grubb, who still insists teachers -> needn't spend very much classroom time on phonics or word decoding. -> "We didn't even cite researchers. It was philosophizing about making -> sense of one's world by using literature, and it promoted the idea -> that skills be taught to kids in the context of exploring literature, -> not from separate how-to books. It never said don't use phonics. It -> told teachers to look at the research about phonics on their own, and -> apply it wisely." You know, this quote reminds me a lot of how some people interpret the NCTM Standards for Curriculum, a similarly controversial document in the mathematics education community. (BTW, California also has a Mathematics Framework which appeared a couple of years ago, based on the NCTM Standards, and similarly very nebulous in meaning.) I have conversed with math teachers who claim that the Standards and California framework _state_ that grade school teachers should no longer teach fractions. Yet, I have both of these documents and have read them, and nowhere in them can I find such a statement. In any case, I have been informed by some of my colleagues at the high school where I work, that there are elementary teachers who are no longer teaching fractions (thank goodness, not MY children's school!), and the teacher in charge of our remedial math class at our school has used this to explain why she no longer believes she should teach that topic either, but just give them a fraction capable calculator. Arrggghh! -> Whole language purists like Barbara Flores at Cal State San -> Bernardino peddled the idea, via teacher credentialing classes, that -> teaching phonics and other skills directly and -> systematically to children was actually bad for them. According to -> teachers who were trained at Cal State Northridge, Cal State San -> Bernardino, USC and other California colleges, the reading -> methodology course was reduced to a "child-centered" discussion -> dominated by whole language ideas. By 1995, some 10,000 fresh new -> teachers had poured into California gradeschools, thousands of whom -> had no idea how to teach beginning reading. I wonder why the school my children attend, which is located in Los Angeles County, but not in L.A. Unified, has not been plagued by this problem? Perhaps because I live in an area with many professional parents who demand that their children do well in school? We do have "open enrollment" here in California, which allows parents to sign their kids up to attend any public school, regardless of where they live, providing their is room for the child. The teachers at my children's school seem to teach a smattering of the traditional skills, including phonics. They do get grammar lessons, spelling tests and my daughter even brought home an old primer last year from which she had to read some stories for homework. Sheila s --- PCBoard (R) v15.22/M 10 * Origin: Castle of the Four Winds...subjective reality? (1:218/804) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DCY00001 Date: 08/27/96 From: SHEILA KING Time: 05:26pm \/To: CHARLES BEAMS (Read 3 times) Subj: Blackboard Bungle 6 -> According to research director Reid Lyon, the study found that in -> normal children the eye "decodes" every single letter, then melds the -> letters into sounds and words so effortlessly that the process cannot -> be observed by the human eye. Indeed, Lyon says that the very speed -> of the decoding process is probably what caused California's whole -> language proponents to claim that the mind skips over and guesses -> words from context. Unfortunately, they used this misbegotten belief -> to insist that children were being forced into "unnatural" and -> "joyless" skills-based reading methods. -> Says Lyon, "Fluent readers decode so fast that they don't even know -> they are tearing each word apart. It is unconscious and automatic. -> They spend all their time considering the meaning of what they read. This bit made me feel a lot more secure about my recent response to Erica Long. She had asked whether I read every word or skip over some when I read, and I am even more convinced than I was at that time that I do read every word. Sheila --- PCBoard (R) v15.22/M 10 * Origin: Castle of the Four Winds...subjective reality? (1:218/804) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DCY00002 Date: 08/27/96 From: SHEILA KING Time: 05:47pm \/To: CHARLES BEAMS (Read 3 times) Subj: Blackboard Bungle 8 -> teacher Patricia Franco Simonowski uses a traditional reading -> approach with heavy homework and lots of repetition. Simonowski is -> one of the apparently few teachers who has read Honig's reading -> framework in detail. She keeps it in her classroom, where she -> periodically pulls it out and pores over it in disgust. -> "I don't think many teachers have actually benefitted from reading -> this thing," says Simonowski, pointing to a page of the framework. "I -> tried out these concepts, and I see this framework for what it is: a -> jobs program for tutors, reading consultants and child psychiatrists. -> Give me a child who has been taught simple discipline at home, and I -> will use what we all know about teaching reading to give you a child -> who can read and write fluently." The private school my children attended a couple of years ago (my son for grades K-3 and my daughter for Pre-K and K) used a very traditional regimented, yet cohesive and well-tested, curriculum for teaching reading. It was called the "Carden Method", and every child in their school (they claimed) would learn to read. They did limit class sizes to 25, and teachers taught in reading groups of 8 students. Every child got individual attention from the teacher each day for reading instruction that was heavily phonics based. To deal with a number of the "exceptions" to phonics that we have in the English language, the school taught French, beginning in Pre-K, believing that by the time children started encountering many of the exception words in 2nd grade or beyond, they would be able to point to the French words to explain a lot of the exceptions. Sheila --- PCBoard (R) v15.22/M 10 * Origin: Castle of the Four Winds...subjective reality? (1:218/804) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DCY00003 Date: 08/27/96 From: SHEILA KING Time: 05:57pm \/To: CARL BOGARDUS (Read 3 times) Subj: Ford, discipline, etc. -> However, I am responsible for computer operations for the entire -> building, so I have to keep things running. Sounds like this will keep you hopping, in spite of being advisory-, and duty-free. -> We hope another lab will be put in when they begin the final -> construction in the spring. Good luck. We are supposed to be getting a new computer lab also (the admin calls it a "Multi-media lab"). Planning is supposed to begin in earnest this year. _Maybe_ the lab will be ready to go before the school year is over. It is supposed to be a lab without regular classes scheduled into it, where teachers can take their classes when they want to do computer work. Sheila --- PCBoard (R) v15.22/M 10 * Origin: Castle of the Four Winds...subjective reality? (1:218/804) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DCY00004 Date: 08/27/96 From: SHEILA KING Time: 06:33pm \/To: CHARLES BEAMS (Read 3 times) Subj: Whole Lang 1 -> SK>Reading must be FREE of what is on the page????? I thought the -> whole SK>point to reading was to interpret WHAT is on the PAGE? -> As I understand it, some interpret the reading process as a fluid -> motion - the reader's eyes flow across the page absorbing words, -> images and information all as one process. But, a researcher noted in the Jill Stewart article refutes the idea that reading is _not_ the breaking down of every word on the page. Besides, if this is what the person who made that statement meant, he should have said so. Saying "reading should be FREE of what is on the page" is some vague, emotional statement that is not clear what is meant by that (although you do a good job of explaining it, given the amount of time you've spent looking up articles on Whole Language). -> If any of the material in the Jill Stewart article would be of any -> use to you in that debate, Jill told me that she had, more or less, -> turned that article into the public domain because of the importance -> of the topic. I would guess you could use some, or all , of that -> article to help you in the discussion. Thanks for the offer, but that "debate/discussion" is no longer in progress. She did not respond to the last e-mail I sent her at the beginning of the summer. Perhaps, though, I will post it to the newsgroup. Sheila --- PCBoard (R) v15.22/M 10 * Origin: Castle of the Four Winds...subjective reality? (1:218/804) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DCY00005 Date: 08/27/96 From: SHEILA KING Time: 06:37pm \/To: CAROLYNNE BLEWITT (Read 3 times) Subj: computer technology -> You appear to know quite a lot about computer technology. Uh, well ... some, anyway. -> Do you have any ideas about how computers can be used in the primary -> school classroom. I teach at the secondary level, so I am not a good resource for ideas on primary ed. -> Should they be used only to enable students to word process their -> writing or as a reward for students to play on when they have -> finished early????? I have a problem with using computers for "playing on" in school. And what of using them as "rewards" for students who have finished their work early. There are then some kids who will never get a chance to use the computer at all, since some kids will never finish their work early (my 10 year old son most likely being one of them!). I would not announce to the class that the computers are to be used for any types of games, although you might have some "game" software that teaches or reinforces important skills. I would call it "enrichment" and make sure that I could identify what skills I was expecting the students to get from such software. I would also be careful that all children in the class have a chance to get some time on the computer. To use the computer in a classroom as _only_ a word processing device is a misuse of the machine, IMO. It is capable of so much more, and is being underutilized if its use is so restricted. Just my opinions, since you asked... Sheila --- PCBoard (R) v15.22/M 10 * Origin: Castle of the Four Winds...subjective reality? (1:218/804) -> SK>This reminds me of the program I wrote recently to model the game -> of SK>"Life" as played out on a computer. ...... -> SK>I am considering assigning this as a programming problem to my -> class SK>this year. Are you familiar with the game? I had seen it -> before, but SK>never programmed it until last week. -> I'm familiar with the game, I haven't attempted to program -> it myself; is it a difficult process? Not really. I managed the program in a couple of hours. The logic is fairly simple. It's the details of input/output, correctly counting loops, etc.. that can mess you up (one of those looping problems had me going for a while). -> I'd be inclined to think that it might involve filling a 2 -> dimensional matrix -> with a repeating pattern, doubling the number of interations -> on each pass? Far simpler than that. I used two 2-dimensional matrices, one for the current generation, one for the upcoming generation. For each cell in the matrix of the current generation you do a count of the number of living vs. dead(or empty) surrounding cells (as this is the criterion that determines whether the particular cell under investigation will live or die in the succeeding generation), and then mark the cell under investigation appropriately in the succeeding generation matrix. No doubling or iterations or recursion or anything like that. -> Then you map the patterns on the screen matrix in random fashion? -> Are you planning on including -> attrition (or consumption) to complicate the doubling -> process? Maybe I should have explained the rules of the game first. There is no "doubling" process in the game in the way you are thinking of (sounds to me like the typical "exponential growth" taught as an application/example in high school math classes). If you're interested in the specific rules, let me know. I'll look them up and post them here. --- PCBoard (R) v15.22/M 10 * Origin: Castle of the Four Winds...subjective reality? (1:218/804) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DCY00006 Date: 08/27/96 From: SHEILA KING Time: 06:46pm \/To: RON MCDERMOTT (Read 3 times) Subj: The game of LIFE -> SK>This reminds me of the program I wrote recently to model the game -> of SK>"Life" as played out on a computer. ...... -> SK>I am considering assigning this as a programming problem to my -> class SK>this year. Are you familiar with the game? I had seen it -> before, but SK>never programmed it until last week. -> I'm familiar with the game, I haven't attempted to program -> it myself; is it a difficult process? Not really. I managed the program in a couple of hours. The logic is fairly simple. It's the details of input/output, correctly counting loops, etc.. that can mess you up (one of those looping problems had me going for a while). -> I'd be inclined to think that it might involve filling a 2 -> dimensional matrix -> with a repeating pattern, doubling the number of interations -> on each pass? Far simpler than that. I used two 2-dimensional matrices, one for the current generation, one for the upcoming generation. For each cell in the matrix of the current generation you do a count of the number of living vs. dead(or empty) surrounding cells (as this is the criterion that determines whether the particular cell under investigation will live or die in the succeeding generation), and then mark the cell under investigation appropriately in the succeeding generation matrix. No doubling or iterations or recursion or anything like that. -> Then you map the patterns on the screen matrix in random fashion? -> Are you planning on including -> attrition (or consumption) to complicate the doubling -> process? Maybe I should have explained the rules of the game first. There is no "doubling" process in the game in the way you are thinking of (sounds to me like the typical "exponential growth" taught as an application/example in high school math classes). If you're interested in the specific rules, let me know. I'll look them up and post them here. --- PCBoard (R) v15.22/M 10 * Origin: Castle of the Four Winds...subjective reality? (1:218/804) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DCY00007 Date: 08/27/96 From: SHEILA KING Time: 07:54pm \/To: CHARLIE WATERS (Read 3 times) Subj: Welcome to the Echo -> Greetings, All.. -> -> Just a quick note to let everyone know that this ECHO is now -> being carried by The NeverEnding BBS located in Deltona, -> Florida, USA. Welcome Charlie, Glad to have you aboard. Sheila King Moderator, EDUCATOR 1:218/804 cking@cyberg8t.com P.S. -> Give us a call at (904) 789-8383 or via telnet at -> bbs.neverending.com I am going to try your telnet. I've been searching for a FidoNet BBS that is "telnet-able" and carries this echo. Several former participants who have lost their access (due to the Fido BBS they called closing down) have asked me if it is possible to access this forum from the Internet. --- PCBoard (R) v15.22/M 10 * Origin: Castle of the Four Winds...subjective reality? (1:218/804)