--------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DB^00015 Date: 07/28/96 From: RICK PEDLEY Time: 10:17pm \/To: LEONA PAYNE (Read 2 times) Subj: Notes from School to -=> Quoting Leona Payne to Ron Mcdermott <=- RM> seems far out, but I seem to recall some guy getting reamed RM> for saying something along the lines of: "That little RM> monkey is really quick!". That would be the late Howard Cosell, who was likely drunk at the time :) RM> Those of us old enough know, that RM> this expression has nothing to do with race, and more to do RM> with the age of the person being observed, but that didn't RM> prevent someone from taking offense! I'd be amazed if there RM> hasn't been something similar concerning the Sun's mascot! I don't think there was any doubt what he meant in this instance. He may as well have called him a "spear chucker" and have done with it. coffeerp@adan.kingston.net ] COFFEE MUG SOFTWARE ] ___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.20 --- InterEcho 1.18 * Origin: CrossRoads * Kingston, Ont. (1:249/1) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DB^00016 Date: 07/30/96 From: MATT SMITH Time: 01:20am \/To: CARL BOGARDUS (Read 3 times) Subj: Re: Businesses Want Standards CB> MS> I take the position that whole separate CB> MS> vocational programs are needed, rather than one or CB> MS> two classes each year grafted into a standard CB> MS> liberal-arts curriculum. CB> CB> Aren't these being developed in your area?? Our community colleges CB> are CB> pushing this for the HSs locally. Students can even take courses in CB> HS that CB> count for credit either at the local university or the community CB> college. North Carolina HS grad requirements have gone the other route. Students are required to take more of the college-prep stuff than ever, even if they're totally unsuited to college. --- Simplex BBS (v1.07.00Beta [DOS]) * Origin: NighthawkBBS, Burlington NC 910-228-7002 HST Dual (1:3644/6) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DB^00017 Date: 07/30/96 From: MATT SMITH Time: 01:23am \/To: DALE HILL (Read 3 times) Subj: Re: Vocational DH> It is interesting, and I tend to agree that there should be solid DH> vocational tracks for students to pursue but there is too the overall DH> value of the liberal arts education. Now mind you I was one of those DH> in HS that couldn't see the reason behind a liberal arts DH> education...I DH> mean I was going to be an accountant, what did the classics, history, DH> language, sociology etc, have to do with keeping books. Well, I was DH> young and just didn't have a whole lot of life experiences behind me DH> to DH> really put a value on those things. It wasn't until I'd completed a DH> 2 DH> yr business school and tried to secure a meaningful job that it hit DH> me. DH> Yes, many places focused on the credential of a 4 yr degree, but I DH> had DH> my present employer at the time explain it best (Coopers & Lybrand - DH> Hartford CT office) One of our personnel managers explained that the DH> whole process of being able to express oneself, formulate arguements, DH> put things in a historical perspective, interact w/and comprehend DH> others behaviors (among other things) were all valuable skills -- in DH> addition to being technically proficient in a particular discipline. My grandfather could do all those things...and he was a high school dropout. --- Simplex BBS (v1.07.00Beta [DOS]) * Origin: NighthawkBBS, Burlington NC 910-228-7002 HST Dual (1:3644/6) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DB^00018 Date: 07/30/96 From: MATT SMITH Time: 01:52am \/To: SHEILA KING (Read 3 times) Subj: Re: Truancy Laws/Penalties SK> Even as President Clinton praised the city of Monrovia's innovative SK> anti-truancy efforts Monday, students at Monrovia High School debated SK> the effectiveness of the policies. SK> The city's anti-truancy law requires police officers to hand out $125 SK> tickets to youths who are caught outside school without a valid SK> excuse. SK> Besides, said Paul Bower, 15, "teachers don't care if you ditch. SK> If you show up to class and you're stoned and stuff, they don't like SK> that, but they don't care if you ditch." SK> Teachers would disagree. So would parents. So would Clinton. I don't know anything about the socioeconomic makeup of Monrovia, but I'd tend to agree with that student. Any article that implies that _all_ parents care if their kid cuts class or cuts school is just reprinting a news release. I know better because I was a friend of my HS's attendance secretary, and she dealt with many parents who didn't give a hoot if their kid came or not. Many parents even wrote preposterous excuses to keep their kid from being penalized for truancy (suspended!), and I saw those excuses on the attendance bulletin that the attendance secretary put out daily. At my HS, which had kids from all socioeconomic backgrounds, poor kids just cut and didn't care about getting suspended, but middle-class parents and rich parents wrote the preposterous excuses. By mid-year, at least 60 kids (out of 1300) had missed 1/3 of class days...without any real medical excuse. --- Simplex BBS (v1.07.00Beta [DOS]) * Origin: NighthawkBBS, Burlington NC 910-228-7002 HST Dual (1:3644/6) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DB^00019 Date: 07/30/96 From: MATT SMITH Time: 01:53am \/To: SHEILA KING (Read 3 times) Subj: Re: Attendance in AZ SK> BTW, I notice that you wrote _UN_excused absences. Are these parents SK> not SK> covering up for their children and saying they were "sick" or SK> something? SK> We have a fair number of parents who do that at our school. We had that here in North Carolina when I was in HS in the late 70s, and it still goes on. --- Simplex BBS (v1.07.00Beta [DOS]) * Origin: NighthawkBBS, Burlington NC 910-228-7002 HST Dual (1:3644/6) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DB^00020 Date: 07/30/96 From: MATT SMITH Time: 01:55am \/To: CHARLES BEAMS (Read 3 times) Subj: Re: Girl Can't Escape Sexism CB> My wife, who teaches 4th grade, tells me that she often catches CB> herself CB> favoring the boys in her class. In particular, her favorites are the CB> boys who are generally good kids but who have a little bit of the CB> devil in CB> them. If schools are sexist institutions favoring boys, it's a teaching staff that's 3/4 female doing it! --- Simplex BBS (v1.07.00Beta [DOS]) * Origin: NighthawkBBS, Burlington NC 910-228-7002 HST Dual (1:3644/6) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DB^00021 Date: 07/30/96 From: LEONA PAYNE Time: 08:33pm \/To: ALL (Read 2 times) Subj: Ann Landers letter Was very surprised to catch this in last night's Phx Gazette: ---cut--- Dear Ann, Our 12 year-old son fit the behavioral pattern of the lad in your column. We, too, had smashed furniture and multiple suspensions from school. "Don" had a near genius IQ but did poorly in school, which posed a mystery. One of his teachers said, "This is not a behavioral problem. Your son is mentally ill." We took him for a psychiatric evaluation, and, of course, she was right. That was the day the healing began. We will be forever grateful to the teacher. Somewhere in the Mid-West. ---cut--- I don't know about the rest of the teachers in this echo, but if the above described teacher had been in my district, the parents at the best probably would have ignored her advice & at the worst, would have complained about her to her principal. I suppose some parents might have sued. I was told by a social worker year before last that I couldn't even say the words "Attention Deficit" or "hyperactivity" to a parent to compare what I had observed about a student's behavior in class to the list of symptoms of that disorder. She further added that to do was to make a diagnosis which would create liability for the district to pay for the child's treatment. I argued with her on the basis that a) I am not a doctor & thus am not offering a medical diagnosis & b) I am allowed to assess a student's health & suggest a trip to the eye doctor or hearing tests or a trip to the nurse for a headache or skinned knee. Why can I not be considered a reliable enough observer of a student's work habits to reach a conclusion with regards to the student's lack of ability to complete a task or to master urges of impulsive behavior. I can't imagine how a suggestion of mental illness would be accepted, unless the parents already had an inkling of it or needed the nudge to get them out of denial. Leona Payne ... Your family's Coat-of-Arms ties in the back - is that normal? --- Via Silver Xpress V4.3P SW12194 * Origin: The Union Jack BBS, Phoenix, AZ, USA. (602) 274-9921 (1:114/260) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DB^00022 Date: 07/30/96 From: LEONA PAYNE Time: 11:57am \/To: SHEILA KING (Read 2 times) Subj: Re: You don't know jack LP>> And you were my inspiration. Great minds think alike. Or is it, great LP>> mimes ride a bike? SK> OK, have you been playing that computer game "You Don't Know Jack" ? Uh, no. But I know kids who've been written up for using that expression. ;^) SK> This sounds alot like the "Gibberish Question" category. (Great SK> quiz-show format game with nice sound/graphics. Entertaining but a bit SK> risque with a disclaimer on the back of the box that it is intended for SK> adults. If we had course review software of this type for students, SK> they'd probably enjoy reviewing a lot more.) Isn't it the truth? They'd enjoy anything a lot more than what they have to do now. Leona Payne ... Five words every college grad knows..."You want fries with that?" --- Via Silver Xpress V4.3P SW12194 * Origin: The Union Jack BBS, Phoenix, AZ, USA. (602) 274-9921 (1:114/260) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DB^00023 Date: 07/30/96 From: LEONA PAYNE Time: 11:58am \/To: DAN TRIPLETT (Read 2 times) Subj: Re: Teaching Responsible Thin DT> Leona, This sound like William Glasser's control theory. Is that what DT> this is and has Edward Ford borrowed from his ideas? Whoa, Dan. Yes, it is. Yes, he did. And BOY, did you quote a lot to add just two little lines. Leona Payne ... Discoveries are made by not following instructions. --- Via Silver Xpress V4.3P SW12194 * Origin: The Union Jack BBS, Phoenix, AZ, USA. (602) 274-9921 (1:114/260) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DB^00024 Date: 07/30/96 From: LEONA PAYNE Time: 08:32pm \/To: SHEILA KING (Read 2 times) Subj: Re: Attendance in AZ SK> Howdy Leona, ->> With the recent cuts in school funding, principals have been looking ->> for more & more creative ways to increase attendance; the more ->> students who attend a school, the more money the school qualifies to ->> receive. SK> Ahh, true, true. Obviously doesn't apply at my school. SK>> BTW, I notice that you wrote _UN_excused absences. Are these SK>> parents not covering up for their children and saying they were SK>> "sick" or something? We have a fair number of parents who do SK>> that at our school. Some are. And those are the ones who will probably end up in Sheriff Joe's tent city for 30 days. SK> Geez. No wonder their kids have the problems that they do. If the parent SK> can't even be bothered to notify the school... Some are not even checking to see if report cards are sent home or if the kid makes it to school. SK> Is there a time limit (within so many days of the absence or something?) The office will accept notes a long time after. In fact, it is a homebase teacher's responsibility to hound the kid to get notes. SK> Can a parent send in a note _after_ it has been called "unexcused" and SK> have it reversed to "excused"? Some parents do this at our school. I'm Yes, but I don't know how impressed the court will be. Once they get a letter, it has moved out of the school's bailiwick & into the city prosecutor's. SK> not sure how wide a berth the attendance secretaries allow on this one. SK> I think one additional day, or something very short like that. We wouldn't get many at that rate. SK> That's good to hear. They've talked about revamping attendance policies SK> at our school many times over the years, and they've even implemented SK> some "changes", but as a classroom teacher, I haven't noticed the SK> difference. In homeroom and my rememdial algebra classes that I was SK> teaching there was a fairly high degree of absenteeism. In the honors SK> classes, not too much. However, the few honors kids who were frequently SK> absent had great difficulties in the class and a strong attendance SK> policy might've helped them get back on track. But what can you do when SK> the parent is always writing notes saying the kid is sick? Not much, I SK> guess. As I remember, it was a lot harder to get students & parents at private school to take attendance seriously, which strikes me as odd, since one would think they'd be there with bells on, paying for it & all. We had kids taken out for month long vacations or who didn't come back from school holidays for days or weeks. Of course, we still have some of that going on in public school, but not as much & after all, there are legal consequences to doing so too often. Our private school parents didn't even consider that someone would turn them in for truancy. Leona Payne ... "What do you mean you `Killed him, cha-cha-cha'?" -- Lister --- Via Silver Xpress V4.3P SW12194 * Origin: The Union Jack BBS, Phoenix, AZ, USA. (602) 274-9921 (1:114/260)