--------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DB400037 Date: 07/02/96 From: RICK PEDLEY Time: 08:41pm \/To: MELVIN BILLIK (Read 4 times) Subj: Matt Smith -=> Quoting Melvin Billik to All <=- MB> I may not always agree with what Matt says, but I think his posts HAVE MB> been reasonably intelligent and well-stated. Well that's your prob.. er opinion, Melvin. Many would disagree with that position and in fact are doing so daily. MB> I would hope there is room for various perspectives and intellectual MB> discussions, without hostile responses. Yes, that's what we would all like, intellectual discussion. My brother is an electrical engineer in Saskatchewan, and on occasion I change the batteries in my Walkman. Does that make me an authority on anything to do with electrical engineering? NO! Next! :) MB> Again, I have only started posting recently and I don't want to create MB> a war here (although that can be fun, too, for a brief period of time). MB> Perhaps I'm unaware of some past battles, but it does seem like we can MB> discuss and disagree without being disagreeable. Yes, but Matt has been going on like this since long before I can remember, I'm talking a couple of years at least. Enough is enough. coffeerp@adan.kingston.net ] COFFEE MUG SOFTWARE ] ___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.20 --- InterEcho 1.18 * Origin: CrossRoads * Kingston, Ont. (1:249/1) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DB400038 Date: 07/03/96 From: RICK PEDLEY Time: 11:25am \/To: DAN TRIPLETT (Read 3 times) Subj: Class size over-rated -=> Quoting Dan Triplett to Melvin Billik <=- DT> the classroom teacher. I think a number of studies have been DT> conducted, some bogus, and some highly regarded...concerning the DT> "correlations" between classroom size success. The findings are in DT> favor of smaller classrooms. I hope you read in another post what I DT> said about a saturation point in class sizes. There is a point when DT> classes become unmanageable due to the large numbers. And even if there are no "problem" students, the style of teaching has to change, usually for the worse: less one-on-one teaching, more Socratic lecture style teaching, fewer evaluations, less tailoring of the curriculum to suit different learning styles and abilities, less time and patience to deal with students' personal problems that are disrupting learning, less energy during prep time to come up with quality teaching material and presentations.. coffeerp@adan.kingston.net ] COFFEE MUG SOFTWARE ] ___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.20 --- InterEcho 1.18 * Origin: CrossRoads * Kingston, Ont. (1:249/1) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DB400039 Date: 07/03/96 From: SHEILA KING Time: 12:44pm \/To: ALL (Read 4 times) Subj: Let's play nice Despite frequent posting of the guidelines, we are having some minor problems here. OK....did everyone READ the guidelines? Raise your hands if you didn't do your homework!!! You in the back with your head down on the desk, SIT UP AND PAY ATTENTION! Let me point out especially #1: Treat others with respect and #4: Let the MODERATOR do the moderating. Treating others with respect: It is ok to attack points in someone's post. It is not ok to attack the person. It is ok to say, "You have contradicted yourself" and quote examples. It is not ok to imply someone IS illogical or stupid themself. BTW: if you READ the guidelines, you will note that under #1 you are not permitted to make jokes against entire groups of persons or professions. That pretty much means no lawyer jokes. Now, if you want to take it to netmail, you may. the guidelines follow AGAIN since I have been getting e-mail on the goings on in this conference the last couple of days. Let's all learn to play nicely together. Sheila King Moderator, EDUCATOR 1:218/804 cking@cyberg8t.com ****************************************************************** EDUCATOR Rules Submitted on 28 Apr 96 EDUCATOR.RUL ====================================== | Purpose of the EDUCATOR conference | ====================================== The EDUCATOR conference is an electronic meeting place where Educators from around the world can gather to discuss issues related to their profession. (This area is NOT a complaint forum for the general public on the sad state of education. Furthermore, it is difficult to appreciate another person's position until one has "walked a mile in their shoes". Non-professional educators should refrain from critical remarks on the length of teachers' work schedules, their motivation and dedication, their reasons for choosing their profession and the like. Such remarks are non-productive and off-topic. Similarly, comparisons between professions attempting to show teachers do no more or no less than persons in other professions are off-topic.) =========================================================== | GUIDELINES for participation in the EDUCATOR Conference | =========================================================== 1. TREAT OTHERS WITH RESPECT. Do not engage in name calling or "flaming" with other individuals. Likewise, insults against groups or professions will not be tolerated. If discussion does not lead you to agree with others, politely agree to disagree. If a message makes you mad, either do not reply, or wait a day or two to reply until you have "cooled off". 2. WRITE MESSAGES OF GENERAL INTEREST. Observe the purpose of this echo and do not post "off-topic" messages (see below). Off-topic responses should be handled in netmail. Use local echoes on your BBS for personal exchanges. This is an international conference. Persons in Australia do not care about your meeting in NY. 3. BE BRIEF. Quote just enough of the message to which you are replying to remind others of the context of your reply. Do not repeat yourself in multiple messages. Do not post LONG texts from other sources (more than 3 or 4 pages). If unsure, check with the Moderator before posting. Enter only a few messages each day. 4. IGNORE INAPPROPRIATE MESSAGES. Let the Moderator and Sysops do their job. Do not respond to such posts nor discuss them in the conference. You may send netmail or e-mail to the Moderator or bring it to your Sysop's attention. 5. TAKE DIRECTION FROM THE MODERATOR GRACEFULLY, whether it occurs in private netmail or in the conference. It is no big deal and there is no need to discuss it. Just get back on track so we can all enjoy this forum. OFF-TOPIC SUBJECTS. DO NOT DISCUSS THESE IN THIS AREA: ======================================================= Creationism vs. Evolution, Politics, Religion, Separation of Church & State, Homeschooling. There are other appropriate conferences for these topics. In conclusion, please enjoy participating here. Take what you can learn from the echo. Contribute with a mind towards being informative and constructive. And if I can be of any help, let me know. Sheila King Moderator, EDUCATOR 1:218/804 cking@cyberg8t.com --- PCBoard (R) v15.22/M 10 * Origin: Castle of the Four Winds...subjective reality? (1:218/804) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DB400040 Date: 07/03/96 From: SHEILA KING Time: 12:59pm \/To: ALL (Read 4 times) Subj: Re: Matt Smith ****** Do NOT reply to this message in EDUCATOR. ********* ****** Reply only in Netmail or e-mail. ********* As much as I dislike to single out an individual participant, it seems as though Matt has attracted so much attention lately that I must say something. These are FACTS: 1. Matt posts bold messages with extreme points of view in order to spark discussion/debate. 2. Matt posts responses that contain faulty logic, evades issues and gives responses that do not seem to have anything to do with the questions put to him. (He does not do this exclusively, but certainly frequently.) 3. Matts posts become more numerous when other participants engage in dialog with him. All of these things can be easily documented by reading Matt's posts over a length of time. Why does Matt post these types of messages? Is it because he is unable to post in any other fashion? Is it because he enjoys baiting the other participants here? We will probably never know. In any case, there is no rule against writing poor quality messages. There are rules, however, against calling someone (or their posts) stupid or making deragatory remarks against some group they may be a member of, including their profession. If Matt (and his messages) are frustrating you (and we've ALL been there), may I suggest that you ignore him and cease replying. We've never all been able to do that at the same time, and there he still sits. If you feel that Matt (or any other individual) is in violation of the conference guidelines, please send me a copy of the message in NETMAIL or E-MAIL with your comments regarding what rule has been violated and I will review it. Do NOT respond to this message in the conference. I am happy to take responses via Netmail or e-mail. Sheila King Moderator, EDUCATOR 1:218/804 cking@cyberg8t.com --- PCBoard (R) v15.22/M 10 * Origin: Castle of the Four Winds...subjective reality? (1:218/804) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DB400041 Date: 06/30/96 From: BOB MOYLAN Time: 04:50pm \/To: SHEILA KING (Read 4 times) Subj: Technology In Classroom Sheila King On (28 Jun 96) was overheard to say to Dan Triplett SK> I think this last quote is certainly making a valid point. Technology SK> is advancing so rapidly that we don't even have time to evaluate its SK> appropriate use before something new has already been invented to take SK> its place. It's getting to be impossible to keep up with the new SK> advances. I hope I'm not misconstruing what you mean here but your comment reminds of something that I, and others, have said here before. It's not always (if ever?) necessary to know everything, or even a little bit about everything, IF you have the knowledge of where to look and the ability to retrieve the information needed for what ever purpose. That doesn't exclude traditional sources of information (text books, hard copy encyclopedias etc) but certainly does include WWW sources. I know that I've been able to gather a lot more information in a far shorter period of time by doing web searches than by haunting the library. I'm not implying that libraries are out dated, just not as easy to use.. Bob ... A royal Egyptian passing gas is a toot uncommon. --- PPoint 2.00 * Origin: What's The Point? Virginia Beach, VA USA (1:275/429.5) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DB400042 Date: 07/01/96 From: BOB MOYLAN Time: 12:28am \/To: TOM COTTON (Read 4 times) Subj: Technology in Classroom Tom Cotton On (30 Jun 96) was overheard to say to Arthur Abel TC> expression of others. It must be relatively difficult to ACCIDENTALLY TC> access the DARKER SIDE or I am sure I would have been there by now. It is much more than "relatively" difficult. I have gone looking to see just what is needed to find some of the stuff that the framers of the CDA were talking about. It's there, no one doubts that; what I've found has been 90% text based. The alt.binaries.you name it all require software that can convert and read .jpg, MIME, and other similar files. Quicktime that came with my copy of Win95 won't do that - or I don't know how to make it do it -. I have a 9 year old who is becoming more and more savvy on how to navigate the inet and was having some serious doubts about allowing him inet access as a user on my account. Both of my ISP's require that the primary adult user (that's me with the plastic to pay for it) specifically authorize all other users on my account to have unlimited access - that would include all the alt.* newsgroups. So far I've not seen that he has been looking for any of the sexually explicit web sites (reviewing the cache files every day assures me of that), that he might someday be looking I don't doubt, when he does we'll have another one of "those" talks. ... You can't drive me crazy; I'm close enough to walk --- PPoint 2.00 * Origin: What's The Point? Virginia Beach, VA USA (1:275/429.5) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DB400043 Date: 07/01/96 From: DAN TRIPLETT Time: 02:18pm \/To: MATT SMITH (Read 4 times) Subj: Re: Discipline On 06-30-96 MATT SMITH wrote to DAN TRIPLETT... MS> DT> I saw many things, when I was a student in college, that I found MS> DT> disturbing. Many of the "discipline problems" you mention were, MS> in MS> DT> my MS> DT> experience, dealing with college freshmen. Yet I saw many MS> "freshmen" MS> DT> taking course work seriously. Still these "FEW" college freshmen MS> did MS> DT> present a discipline challenge to the professors. But the numbers MS> MS> DT> were MS> DT> small and no where near the picture you paint. MS> MS> The problem with intoxicated-in-class college students varies MS> greatly MS> from college to college, but one thing that's true nationwide is that MS> _serious_ campus crime heavily involves intoxicated students (ask a MS> campus-police administrator). The classroom side of the problem can MS> and does MS> sometimes get to the point that the prof will have difficulty MS> teaching, as MS> I've seen happen in several courses. In one a student started a MS> shouting MS> match in class with a prof. MS> Freshmen in college aren't too different from HS seniors, other MS> than for MS> living away from home and having the ability to drink as much as they MS> please MS> and cut class as much as they please while not being subject to either MS> MS> parental discipline or typical HS rules (like attendance). Is it any MS> surprise to you that they are at least as*undisciplined as they were MS> for MS> their HS teachers? MS> MS> --- Simplex BBS (v1.07.00Beta [DOS]) MS> * Origin: NighthawkBBS, Burlington NC 910-228-7002 HST Dual MS> (1:3644/6) * OFFLINE 1.56 * Daddy, Why doesn't this magnet pick up this floppy disk? --- GEcho 1.11+ * Origin: The South Bay Forum - Olympia, WA (360) 923-0866 (1:352/256) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DB400044 Date: 07/01/96 From: DONNA RANSDELL Time: 07:23am \/To: ROBERT BUTLER (Read 3 times) Subj: can you help... > Donna, I know of a place called Interstate Music > Supply. They are located in New Berlin, Wisconsin, as > I recall. I buy stuff from them all the time, good > prices and good service. I'm sure they have an 800 > number, I don't have it with me, though. I'll try to get the number....thanks! -donna --- GEcho 1.00 * Origin: I touch the future; I teach. (1:202/211) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DB400045 Date: 07/01/96 From: MATT SMITH Time: 09:59pm \/To: TOM COTTON (Read 4 times) Subj: Re: National Curriculum TC> MS> Does it matter whether the NAACP won? TC> > Down here, this state faced disputes by activists claiming its TC> then-new TC> >HS competency-for-graduation test was "racist" because a TC> >higher share of blacks than whites failed it. Disputes TC> >like this, regardless of who 'wins', discourage high TC> >standards because officials fear disputes or litigation. TC> TC> Pretty perceptive Matt. The cases always cost money and are TC> therefore TC> avoided when possible And "avoided" by avoiding _any_ standards that are high enough to risk disproportionate failure rates, or by race-norming the tests. South Carolina was sued by the NEA because blacks were less likely than whites to score high enough on the National Teacher Examination to pass the state's certification requirements, and that state lost. As a result, many states have chosen to dodge the issue by simply race-norming the NTE. --- Simplex BBS (v1.07.00Beta [DOS]) * Origin: NighthawkBBS, Burlington NC 910-228-7002 HST Dual (1:3644/6) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 265 EDUCATOR Ref: DB400046 Date: 07/01/96 From: MATT SMITH Time: 10:17pm \/To: LEONA PAYNE (Read 4 times) Subj: Re: Class Size Over-Rated LP> In fact, I've had a few who participated in shenanigans transferred LP> to LP> other periods with smaller enrollment. It appeared that the LP> combination LP> of splitting them from their partners-in-crime & being able to LP> increase LP> the amount of supervision I can give them in a smaller class LP> contributes LP> somewhat to their progress. We agree on something! I had the same experience when the French class I was in in HS taught French to early-elementary kids. --- Simplex BBS (v1.07.00Beta [DOS]) * Origin: NighthawkBBS, Burlington NC 910-228-7002 HST Dual (1:3644/6)