--------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 257 ALTERN. MEDICINE Ref: EDW00000Date: 09/25/97 From: JANE KELLEY Time: 05:52am \/To: GEORGE LAGERGREN (Read 1 times) Subj: Addiction JK> Doctors and medical people can kill legally. They do this much too JK> often when they are too damn stupid to figure out what the real JK> problem is and deal with that instead of reach for the nearest drug JK> and attempt to apply a fast fix. GL> GL> Most M.D.s really do not search for the cause of the problem. And haven't the slightest conception of what addiction is all about. I've worked for some of them in the past who have a patient list of active alcoholics, folks who go to the doc who will keep them going and drinking for a few years after the disease really hits them hard. When the practice of replacing professional nurses in doctor's offices and clinics with high school graduates began, that also ended the ability of the professional nurse to do a nursing assessment before the doctor saw the patient. So half of what used to be done in the way of obtaining any history is gone today. Which is why it takes two or three visits (if one is lucky) for a new doctor to begin to figure out what is wrong. * SPITFIRE v3.5 --- FreeMail 1.10 alpha-3 * Origin: PEACHY KEENO INN BBS * Tacoma,Wa * (206)539-0804 (1:138/190.1) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 257 ALTERN. MEDICINE Ref: EDW00001Date: 09/25/97 From: JANE KELLEY Time: 12:50pm \/To: STEVE KEMP (Read 1 times) Subj: Marijuana & Addicti [1/3 SK> I was speaking of the non-medical and straight up silly terms that SK> youwere using. "Cerebral area of the brain" and such. Hardly a term SK> that aprofessed medical professional would use. Why? Because it's a SK> nonsensical term. Maybe you meant the Cerebral Cortex. THAT would SK> makesense. I've given so many lectures to folks who haven't ever taken any courses in medical terminology that I don't tend to use much of it any more. Doesn't make sense to them at all. They just sit there with eyes glazed over and take a trip someplace. Which is the general reaction when the high falutin' verbage gets slung around by those who think they know what it really says. BUT....I am fully aware that drugs begin to affect the brain at the frontal lobe, then progress toward the back of the head. If they get to the lower area that sits on top of the spinal cord, death is a sure thing. Now the frontal lobe is what is damaged first. That is forever and ever impaired after moderate use of marijuna in some folks. What is not being told in all of this crapola put out by those who think that medical use of the stuff is so wonderful!!! I THINK THAT ANYONE WHO USES POT< KNOWING THAT IS IS A WEED, WITH ALL OF THE DANGERS INHERENT IN ANY SUBSTANCE LIKE IT< is crazy. Certifiably insane. There are other drugs which have been synthesized from natural plant sources that have the unwanted side effects taken away. I cannot help but wonder just how many would still want to have medical marijuna if it were possible to supress the mind altering features that are objectionable to most of us. * SPITFIRE v3.5 --- FreeMail 1.10 alpha-3 * Origin: PEACHY KEENO INN BBS * Tacoma,Wa * (206)539-0804 (1:138/190.1) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 257 ALTERN. MEDICINE Ref: EDW00002Date: 09/25/97 From: JANE KELLEY Time: 12:56pm \/To: DIA SPRIGGS (Read 1 times) Subj: Re: Marijuana & Addicti [1/3 DS> Please get oFF the marijuana topic..it's been hacked to death. THere DS> must be other substances out there that are benefical to the readers There are. Countless. So why do we see the same old tired excuses for legalizing a definite mind altering drug among those who admit to present and past use? * SPITFIRE v3.5 --- FreeMail 1.10 alpha-3 * Origin: PEACHY KEENO INN BBS * Tacoma,Wa * (206)539-0804 (1:138/190.1) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 257 ALTERN. MEDICINE Ref: EDW00003Date: 09/25/97 From: JANE KELLEY Time: 05:46am \/To: STEVE KEMP (Read 1 times) Subj: Marijuana & Addictions SK> And, WHO are you speaking of? I've never met a drug addict that was SK> doing drugs to "fix" anything, except their pain...the taking of the THE ONLY REASON DRUGS ARE USED IS TO AFFECT THE BRAIN AND CENTRAL NERVOUS SYSTEM. In short, to alter the brain chemistry. Period. Anything else is an excuse. This idea of "pain" comes from those who are too psychologically crippled to live in modern society without chemical help. Treatment consists of teaching them how to do just that. 26..30 SK> Do you think people WANT to be addicted to drugs? Do you think that SK> condemning them to prison is the answer? Don't you think that they SK> WANTto stop? Got a clue (and I'm the man to state the FACTS), they DO SK> wantto stop. Remember? I'm the guy that was a drug addict. PLEASE, SK> remember...I said WAS. There is no such thing as "was a drug addict". Had you any form of treatment for addiction or attended even a few meetings of Alcoholics Anonymous or Narcotics Anonymous, you would have learned that. You are permanently addicted to whatever drug you chose plus you have a tendency to become rapidly addicted to any other drug in that same class! Three days of use will be all that it takes to turn you into a confirmed addict to any other drug in the same class. I've seen addicts in recovery for years, have worked for a couple of the best drug counselors in both Tacoma and Seattle. Another one of these, now retired, lives up the road. Just what do you think you can contribute to the knowledge I have piled up from sitting on hard chairs through two pages of seminars and workshops on addiction and related subjects after graduation from the oldest school in the nation for counselors? What have you got to say that those who were incarcerated in the old King County Jail didn't? And I learned from men who had used heroin for years, who pointed out to me the reason why the diabetic inmates had so many problems and other little fine points of medical and nursing care that sometimes escaped those in charge of the place! Your posts indicate a total and complete lack of any real understanding of the disease of addiction or what it takes to break the hold that drugs have on someone and what to do to help that person stay clean and sober. Your experience is limited to one person's, your own. And that, I was informed at Seattle Umiversity, is not enough to do any good at all in this world today. If you want to really do something, then get your rear end to those who will teach you how to help other addicts. * SPITFIRE v3.5 --- FreeMail 1.10 alpha-3 * Origin: PEACHY KEENO INN BBS * Tacoma,Wa * (206)539-0804 (1:138/190.1) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 257 ALTERN. MEDICINE Ref: EDW00004Date: 09/25/97 From: JANE KELLEY Time: 12:52pm \/To: STEVE KEMP (Read 1 times) Subj: Marijuana & Addictions SK> Exactly. But that wasn't my point, but since you bring it up...don't SK> youthink that telling people to take any of these AltMed concoctions SK> isirresponsible, then? At times it is. When folks start acting like doctors and herbalists without the proper credentials, it is. However, I also don't think that we should have to have the use of them tightly regulated. We regulate drugs and we still have all kinds of problems with them. We actually seen to have less problems with what is sold in the average health food store these days. * SPITFIRE v3.5 --- FreeMail 1.10 alpha-3 * Origin: PEACHY KEENO INN BBS * Tacoma,Wa * (206)539-0804 (1:138/190.1) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 257 ALTERN. MEDICINE Ref: EDW00005Date: 09/25/97 From: JANE KELLEY Time: 05:33am \/To: ALEX VASAUSKAS (Read 1 times) Subj: Marijuana as medicine AV> An example of irresponsible use by a few people with prexisting AV> psychological problems. In any event, this is irrelevant to This is a blatant lie. It has been proven such, over and over again, first by Dr. James Milam, and secondly by the 50 years of research into addiction in both Europe and this nation. You can find out what Dr. Milam started by contacting him at: Milam Recovery Program 12845 Ambaum Blvd. S.W. Seattle WA 98146 (206) 241-0890 Or try schick Shadel Hospital 12101 Ambaum Blvd. S.W. Seattle WA 98125 (206) 525-5050 Between these two, every research project done in the entire world on addiction will be eventually known. THE DRUGS PROVIDE THE PSYCHOLOGICAL PROBLEMS. And, the DSM IV that I have around here has information concerning marijuna in more than one place. I copied out most of it at one time, then filed it. I do remember that one of the glaring problems is that this drug is promoted and defended by those who haven't the faintest idea of just how noxious it really is. Folks who don't understand that there are over 2,000 chemicals in pot when it is smoked and that most of these are not good for us at all. AV> To the extent that the DSM IV has value, I have previously cited to AV> youthe pages that discuss marijuana and quoted the language to you AV> thatcontradicts your representations and supports what I have been AV> saying.But, you refuse to read it (or to understand it), and you I've read it, you claim to have done so and I really doubt that. If you have read it at all, you have not taken the time to look in the several places that information concerning marijuana is printed and get it all together. In fact, I submit that your post indicated a lack of anything being together about pot. * SPITFIRE v3.5 --- FreeMail 1.10 alpha-3 * Origin: PEACHY KEENO INN BBS * Tacoma,Wa * (206)539-0804 (1:138/190.1) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 257 ALTERN. MEDICINE Ref: EDW00006Date: 09/25/97 From: JANE KELLEY Time: 12:55pm \/To: STEVE KEMP (Read 1 times) Subj: Marijuana as medicine SK> Oh, so you are a genetic alcoholic AND a sociopath. We've already witnessed your complete and total lack of understanding of addiction and anything connected with it e We've already seen your complete and total ignorance on the subject of addiction and anything related to it. Now please don't try to become an instant expert in mental health. Even the worst practitioners around do have some education in the subject. * SPITFIRE v3.5 --- FreeMail 1.10 alpha-3 * Origin: PEACHY KEENO INN BBS * Tacoma,Wa * (206)539-0804 (1:138/190.1) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 257 ALTERN. MEDICINE Ref: EDW00007Date: 09/26/97 From: SHARON MCCORMICK Time: 09:24am \/To: DIA SPRIGGS (Read 1 times) Subj: Dong Quai DS> Dong Quai is good stuff...normalizes hormones..just make sure you or she DS> doesn't have fibroids....it will aggravate them. Thanks for that, Dia, I hadn't known about the fibroids! --- GAPNet Enhanced * Origin: QUACKERS BBS - Cleveland, Ohio (1:157/443.0) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 257 ALTERN. MEDICINE Ref: EDX00000Date: 09/26/97 From: ALEX VASAUSKAS Time: 06:54am \/To: ALL (Read 1 times) Subj: Comfrey & Hops wanted Hello -- I want to start growing some Comfrey (Symphytum officinalis) and Hops (Humulus lupulus) next spring, but I have been unable to locate the seeds or roots (whatever works best for propagation). No one grows or sells them around here, and they are not in my herb-seed catalogs. I would appreciate any help in obtaining these, either from someone here who has these in their garden or a vendor you know of. I am, of course, willing to pay for them and the postage (from within or outside the U.S.). Unfortunately, I am just starting my first herb garden and do not have any seeds or roots to exchange. My e-mail addresses are Fidonet 1:17/75, Internet alex@who.lsd.bungi.com Thank you Alex --- * Origin: 61 deg. 25' N / 149 deg. 40' W (1:17/75) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 257 ALTERN. MEDICINE Ref: EDX00001Date: 09/26/97 From: ALEX VASAUSKAS Time: 06:56am \/To: ALL (Read 1 times) Subj: Damiana wanted Hello -- I am wanting to grow Damiana (Turnera diffusa var. aphrodisiaca). But, it is not available from any of my seed catalogs. Does anyone have available in their garden or know a vendor who sells the seeds or roots (whatever it takes to grow this plant)? I am of course willing to pay for the seeds or roots and postage-and-handling (from within or outside the U.S.). Unfortunately, I don't have any seeds or roots to exchange since I will be starting my first herb garden next spring. My addresses are Fidonet 1:17/75, Internet alex@who.lsd.bungi.com _The Backyard Medicine Chest (an Herbal Primer)_ by Douglas Schar recommends this herb as a generally strengthening nerve tonic that is especially useful to counteract mental exhaustion from a hectic lifestyle. Thank you --- * Origin: 61 deg. 25' N / 149 deg. 40' W (1:17/75)