--------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 257 ALTERN. MEDICINE Ref: EBE00010Date: 07/07/97 From: STEVE KEMP Time: 04:46pm \/To: JANE KELLEY (Read 1 times) Subj: Marijuana JK>SK>Your postulation that many that start with alcohol and them move JK>SK>on to harder drugs is not factual. MOST people that drink alcohol JK>SK>DON'T do any other drug....well except nicotine. JK>Sonny, I don't know what mountain top you live on behind high walls JK>with barbed wire enclosures that isolates you from reality. The JK>blunt truth is that a "pure" alcoholic is almost unknown today. Most JK>addicts are using at least two drugs besides alcohol and I am not JK>limiting this to caffeine and nictotine. Sorry, Mommy, but you are turning the point around again. YES, people that use drugs do tend to use other drugs and alcohol. The point was that MOST PEOPLE THAT DRINK ALCOHOL DO NOT USE OTHER DRUGS. JK>SK>Many end up in Psych wards by the time they are 20? I don't know JK>SK>what planet you are living on but drug treatment is rather JK>SK>expensive and NOT available to most drug users....AND drug use by JK>SK>and large does not make people totally insane. JK>Drug treatment is almost impossible to obtain for those without JK>funds. Which is why we have such a high rate in this nation. My point, exactly. Thank you. JK> And I am very certain that you have never done intakes or listened JK>to those in the nearest A.A. or N.A. meeting. Why would I go to an A.A. meeting? I'm not a Christian. I have been to R.R. meetings, though. And I am a recovering drug user. JK>I have. And this makes you an expert on drug abuse? I'm not, and neither are you. I sure have seen it from the inside, not just an observer...although I've been that too. --- * CMPQwk #1.42* UNREGISTERED EVALUATION COPY --- HyperMail! v1.22 * Origin: CENTRAL PARK WEST - FOLSOM CA - 916.351.1476 PPI 33.6! (1:203/1476) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 257 ALTERN. MEDICINE Ref: EBE00011Date: 07/08/97 From: STEVE KEMP Time: 01:56am \/To: JANE KELLEY (Read 1 times) Subj: marijuana JK>SK>Marijuana IS NOT addictive, it is (or can be) a habituant. JK>According to those who have used it and are in recovery, marijuana is JK>highly addictive. And they are know what an addictive is compared to a habituant? Of course in treatment the standard mode is to tell EVERYONE that they are addicted, go figure...that is the business they are in. People are being told that they are addicted to other people (co-dependence), or to gambling, or to video games. It's all so much bull-patties...but it's great for business. JK>SK>An addiction is defined partly by the presence of PHYICAL JK>SK>withdrawal symptoms as well as psychological withdrawal symptoms. JK>SK>Habituant withdrawal is marked only by the latter. JK>Bull. What do you call being unable to stand light in a room or not JK>being able to get out of bed in the morning? Light sensitive from being in the dark, and tired...or lazy. JK> What do you call changes in appetite? Hunger, or lack thereof. I was speaking of WITHDRAWAL SYMTOMS, not effects of USING the drug. Of course drugs cause effects, if not...WHY TAKE THEM? If someone never goes outside or eats too much "because of" pot they will most certainly garner some effects like you state. They also tend to get light-headed, feel friendly, and say "Wow, man" alot. Heroin addicts can DIE from withdrawal. --- * CMPQwk #1.42* UNREGISTERED EVALUATION COPY --- HyperMail! v1.22 * Origin: CENTRAL PARK WEST - FOLSOM CA - 916.351.1476 PPI 33.6! (1:203/1476) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 257 ALTERN. MEDICINE Ref: EBE00012Date: 07/08/97 From: STEVE KEMP Time: 01:26am \/To: JANE KELLEY (Read 1 times) Subj: marijuana/men breast canc JK>AV>Notwithstanding your apparently unique universe that puts you in JK>AV>contact with with a small minority of people with personal JK>AV>problems that you and they like to blame on drugs or any other JK>AV>convenient scapegoat for lack of personal responsibility, Steve is JK>AV>absolutely right. In fact, the DEA's Administrative Law Judge, JK>AV>after evaluating all of the evidence that the government could JK>AV>muster to prove that marijuana is harmful, came to very much the JK>AV>same conclusions as Steve did. Judge Francis Young determined JK>AV>that marijuana was one of the safest drugs known to man: JK>Got news for you. No judge is educated enough in this matter to make JK>a determination that makes any sense at all. And YOU are? Got news for YOU...you are living in the dark ages. If you haven't heard the information stated....then......you lacking in information. Noone has stated here that "Pot is good" or "everybody should smoke pot". The point and fact is it IS the safest of the illegal drugs..and even safer than aspirin, I'd dare say (actually, far safer). NO, kids shouldn't do it...they shouldn't do ANY drugs. But to use some "fear of kids getting it" line of reasoning to keep cancer patients from using it is absurd and cruel. Throwing people in prison for using it is draconian and hypocritical. --- * CMPQwk #1.42* UNREGISTERED EVALUATION COPY --- HyperMail! v1.22 * Origin: CENTRAL PARK WEST - FOLSOM CA - 916.351.1476 PPI 33.6! (1:203/1476) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 257 ALTERN. MEDICINE Ref: EBE00013Date: 07/08/97 From: STEVE KEMP Time: 01:49am \/To: JANE KELLEY (Read 1 times) Subj: marijuana/men breast canc JK>SK>JK>There were several members of my daughter's high school class JK>SK>JK>who did not make it to graduation because of this "hardly JK>SK>JK>troublesome drug". JK>SK>How do you know this? Pot made them not graduate, eh. JK>They died in automobile accidents around 2-3 am before they had a JK>chance to graduate. The rate that pot leaves is different that the JK>rate that alcohol does (go find out from someone who loves nitty JK>gritty details, I don't) and that causes problems when kids are JK>driving home from parties. And, if they smoked some pot a week and a half before...it will show in the blood and be called the cause. The effects of alcohol last far longer that pot. If you want to come down from pot all you have to do is eat a sandwich. But I'm sure you knew that. JK>Others die in their sleep from other drug combinations. Not in combination with pot, though. Pot can't kill you. The other drug or drugs can. Pot won't. --- * CMPQwk #1.42* UNREGISTERED EVALUATION COPY --- HyperMail! v1.22 * Origin: CENTRAL PARK WEST - FOLSOM CA - 916.351.1476 PPI 33.6! (1:203/1476) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 257 ALTERN. MEDICINE Ref: EBE00014Date: 07/08/97 From: BRIAN BURGHARDT Time: 09:24pm \/To: STEVE KEMP (Read 1 times) Subj: marijuana/men breast canc -> JK>SK>I doubt it. But, if pot is more available...that would be a GOO -> JK>SK>thing. It's hardly a troublesome drug at all. Actually, I'd dar -> JK>SK>say it is the best drug. It is better physically and emotionall -> JK>SK>on one than ANY other recreational drug. Better than cocaine, -> JK>SK>meth, uppers, downers, or even alcohol. NO adverse side effects -> JK>SK>except "the munchies". -> -> JK>There were several members of my daughter's high school class who -> JK>not make it to graduation because of this "hardly troublesome drug -> -> How do you know this? Pot made them not graduate, eh. -> -> But I did say that ALL drugs and alcohol and even cigarettes should -> not be consumed by kids. Just as driving cars is a right reserved to -> those over the legal age to do so. -> -> The acts of children need to be addressed by those kids -> parents...PERIOD! They aren't MY kids..nor the governments. -> -> JK>I have also worked in a county jail, several treatment units, and -> JK>other places where those who were adversely affected by this "best -> JK>drug" outlined the very real problems they had with the stuff. -> -> So these criminals, drug addicts, and such were thus because of Pot? -> Come on. It's alcohol that causes more crime and also more need for -> treatment than Pot. Thus my point...the SAFEST. If it's not the -> safest, what is? -> -> JK>Keep on defending your "right" to use it. -> -> I'm not defending my right to use it. I DON'T us it. I have. -> Therefore I know what it is like, and I know what I'm talking about. -> I know that it is quite a safe drug. -> -> You can keep defending your belief that putting people in prison is -> GOOD for them...better for them than smoking Pot. But, alcohol is -> A.O.K. cause it's legal. -> -> The use of it, however, is still a Federal crime. -> -> Yep. A illogical and hypocritical system has made it so. -> --- -> * CMPQwk #1.42* UNREGISTERED EVALUATION COPY Sick, very sick my message man from Omni. My brother is on that system. --- HyperMail! v1.22 * Origin: CENTRAL PARK WEST - FOLSOM CA - 916.351.1476 PPI 33.6! (1:203/1476) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 257 ALTERN. MEDICINE Ref: EBE00015Date: 07/07/97 From: STEVE KEMP Time: 05:16pm \/To: JANE KELLEY (Read 1 times) Subj: Re: Witches, Druids JK>SK>JK>Some minds are able to harness and use the electromagnetic JK>SK>JK>fields around us. Others may or may not realize they exist JK>SK>JK>unless they are shamans. JK>SK>Damn, and you think I'M on drugs. JK>For the best documentation on this sort of thing, try "Psychic JK>Discoveries Behind the Iron Curtain" by Sheila Ostarnder and Lynn JK>Schroeder. It was originally printed in May of 1970 by JK>Prentice-Hall, Inc., my copy is a Bantam Book. JK>That is, if you aren't both lazy and stupid. No thanks, I need not read about such silly and specious pap. I am starting to see the kind of "thinker" you are, though. Well, this little gem and the other couple you sent recently do show a person unable to even realize what the points of argument are. Sure you haven't hit the 'scripts a few too many times yourself, Nurse Kelley. --- * CMPQwk #1.42* UNREGISTERED EVALUATION COPY --- HyperMail! v1.22 * Origin: CENTRAL PARK WEST - FOLSOM CA - 916.351.1476 PPI 33.6! (1:203/1476) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 257 ALTERN. MEDICINE Ref: EBE00016Date: 07/09/97 From: BOB MOYLAN Time: 01:09am \/To: JANE KELLEY (Read 1 times) Subj: Acupuncture Jane Kelley (On 06 Jul 97) was overheard expounding to Alan Fletcher JK> At times I do. I don't worship Nature by running around with my JK> clothes off, either. Now THERE is a mental picture to conjure with !!! Check out alt.sex.geriatric ... That's just my opinion... and I could be wrong. --- PPoint 2.03 * Origin: What's The Point? Virginia Beach, VA USA (1:275/429.5) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 257 ALTERN. MEDICINE Ref: EBF00000Date: 07/09/97 From: PAT BRADLEY Time: 10:55am \/To: TY MEISSNER (Read 1 times) Subj: RE: MARIJUANA/MEN BREAST Hello Ty > Here in California marijuana has been plentifully vailable for > decades. > > Legalizing medical marijuana involves such a tiny amount of the > marijuana trade that it has no influnece at all on its general > availability. > Here in South Australia marijuana for personal use has been decriminalised for some years. There are people who still try to make money out of large cash crops - but since the police are now concentrating on them rather than the small user, its not as secure a proposition as it once was! Similarly, kids on the nightclub scene from interstate think SA is great because they can get mj relatively easily - but we don't have anything like the major drug scene and related problems that prohibition states have. Personal use is not tied to the need to get involved with pushers - ergo no 'push' to try harder stuff. regards, Pat (RGN/RPN) (PS - liked your point about lead, in a previous post) --- FLAME v1.1 * Origin: Braintap BBS Adelaide, Oz +61-8-8239-0497 (3:800/449) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 257 ALTERN. MEDICINE Ref: EBF00001Date: 07/09/97 From: PAT BRADLEY Time: 11:24am \/To: CLIFF MORRISON (Read 1 times) Subj: BELL'S PALSY Hello Cliff > I am currently undergoing a MULTITUDE of tests to confirm or rule > out the above. The left side of my face is now completely paralyzed. > Does ANYONE know ANYTHING about this disease? If so I would be MOST > grateful for ANY info you could supply. Even a point in the right > direction would be MOST appreciated! SNIP > To Moderator, this is the correct echo for this is it not? If not > please let me know and accept my apologies in advance. If it is, > great, please ignore the previous sentence. This is a pretty horrendous experience for you. Bell's Palsy is due to paralysis of the facial nerve on one side. Even if the diagnosis has not been confirmed, your advisors should be able to help you with the symptoms - eg have you been using warm (NOT hot) packs to the affected side? eye drops such as liquifilm tears or normal saline wash to the affected eye? there are also facial exercises to help prevent muscle atrophy, and you should probably be using light massage as well. Most cases , I believe, resolve spontaneously within 6 weeks or so. For more information you may also like to post on the ASK_A_NURSE or GRAND_ROUND echoes. regards, Pat (RGN/RPN) --- FLAME v1.1 * Origin: Braintap BBS Adelaide, Oz +61-8-8239-0497 (3:800/449) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 257 ALTERN. MEDICINE Ref: EBF00002Date: 07/09/97 From: BOB MOYLAN Time: 08:18pm \/To: JANE KELLEY (Read 1 times) Subj: A Drink Or 2 A Day Jane Kelley (On 07 Jul 97) was overheard expounding to Bob Moylan BM> Liar Liar pants on fire!!! JK> Is this one of your wittier moments or were you under the influence of JK> too much fire water over the weekend when you wrote this one? The weekend?? On my calendar July 3, 1997 was a Thursday. BM> You posted the following on the date as shown below. Deny it and BM> prove once and for all time that you lie like a rug! JK> My estimate of your emotional age has slipped vastly since receiving JK> this post. I really don't give a hoot what your estimates of anything are, with your post you prove once and for all (not that many needed any convincing) that even when confronted with the evidence of your own ramblings you claim to have said something else. JK> This implies, to anyone who read the entire post Oh never fear, I did read the entire rambling thing that contained not an iota of factual information; merely the musing of a retired nurse who no longer understands what _she_ reads and takes it at face value (which value is most often zilch) and runs with it. JK> and understood what JK> is was saying, that 2-300 years is not enough time to obtain genetic JK> protection especially with the advent of welfare and other methods of JK> interference with natural selection. What drivel and not even neat sidestepping. JK> The Orientals, as I have said in previous posts, have had alcohol for JK> thousands of years which is why they have developed a partial immunity JK> to the worst effects. Bull Jane. Have you ever spent any time in the Orient? I doubt it. There are as many, if not more, alcoholics there as here. JK> I really think that your time would be much better spent in classes on JK> this subject than in these posts of yours, Bob. For at least the one thousandth time ... I have little interest in alcoholics or other substance abusers. It really isn't necessary to attend any classes to plainly see that your posts are full of nonsense and partially remembered bits/pieces of long ago. Put up some verifiable information - if it pans out as you say it does you'd possibly be doing some folks a service. Until then .. well if you don't want to read rebuttals from me either hit what ever key your editor requires to skip posts from me or add me to your twit filter. But then I'd essentially be talking behind your back wouldn't I? I don't think you could stand the thought of that. ... Accept me for what I am - completely unacceptable. --- PPoint 2.03 * Origin: What's The Point? Virginia Beach, VA USA (1:275/429.5)