--------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 246 AUTOMOTIVE Ref: EGW00016 Date: 12/25/97 From: JAY EMRIE Time: 06:38pm \/To: ROY WITT (Read 0 times) Subj: 325i RW> RJT> Once I realized what I was looking at, I didn't blame them for not RW> RJT> wanting to move it out of there -- it was a V-16 engine! RW> Packard and Cadillac both made V16's, both died during the mid-30's. And Lincoln made a V12 in the late 30s. I had one. * OLX 2.1 TD * Barfignugen: Carsickness in a Volkswagen --- RemoteAccess 2.50+ * Origin: Northern Lights! * San Antonio * 210-499-6299 V34/VFC (1:387/23) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 246 AUTOMOTIVE Ref: EGW00017 Date: 12/25/97 From: JAY EMRIE Time: 06:18pm \/To: ROY J. TELLASON (Read 0 times) Subj: Battery sizes RJT>Jack Nelson wrote in a message to Roy Witt: RJT>RW> If you clean those connectors where they've been soldered and then RJT>RW> coat with something like nail polish, they won't oxidize as fast RJT>RW> as if they were left uncleaned and left to the elements. RJT> JN> Even better would be to coat them with grease or an electronics RJT> JN> contact cleaner/protectant because their surface won't break RJT> JN> and let in air, and they can be applied to the battery posts RJT> JN> and terminals before assembly. RJT>No! RJT>You wanna apply that stuff, or any other anticorrosion stuff, *AFTER* you RJT> the connection. You don't want grease or whatever in between two surfaces RJT> are supposed to be making a connection to each other, you want a nice cle RJT>tal-to-metal connection there... In the case of silicone grease, for it to be effective it MUST be applied to CLEAN battery posts and cables BEFORE they are connected. Then when being connected and TIGHTENED the silicone grease is easily forced from between the terminal and post allowing a positive electrical connection but still preventing the air (oxygen) from getting to the metals thus prevents corrosion. Believe me, IT WORKS EXACTLY LIKE THAT. * OLX 2.1 TD * A nude cook needs to have long arms. --- RemoteAccess 2.50+ * Origin: Northern Lights! * San Antonio * 210-499-6299 V34/VFC (1:387/23) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 246 AUTOMOTIVE Ref: EGW00018 Date: 12/25/97 From: JAY EMRIE Time: 06:23pm \/To: ROY WITT (Read 0 times) Subj: battery sizes RW> JE> Seriously: RW> JE> Guess I was mistaken. Back in the early 70s when I saw metric was RW> JE> going to come on us I bought a set of Sears metric tap and dies. In RW> JE> it was a couple of pipe taps. Just dug out the only one I have left RW> JE> and it is a 1/8 B.S.P. !!! Why would they put that in a metric set? RW>Because they're British Standard Pipe taps and are probably bastards in he RW>ican system. So I found out. RW>I'm sure you'll recall that the Brits used English inches for measurements b RW>e they switched to the metric system. All of Europe used BSP pipe reads. RW>The Japs have picked up on BSP as well as using our pipe system. RW>The difference isn't in the measurements, as they will both be the same in E RW>sh or Metric. The difference is in the number of threads per inch or millim RW> if you want. BSP threads are usually one more or one less than American Pi RW>hreads. The taper per inch/millimeter is the same. RW>The metric system has been around a lot longer than my 1963 Machinists Handb RW>and I failed to find any reference to metric pipe threads in it. RW>That was a few years ago and when this subject came up again here, I alled RW>ool supplier to inquire about it. He confirmed what I just told you, above. RW> JE> Seems like when I was working on the gauges on my 77 Datsun PU I RW> JE> needed a metric pipe tap and that is what I used. Since that was RW> JE> almost 20 years ago guess I am not too sure any more. RW>Be assured that you used the right tap. Even if it was a BSP tap. Well, I KNEW I had used the correct tap, simply because it worked perfectly. You just comfirmed it. RW> JE> NOT joking: You'd probably be happier if it was on your regular RW> JE> route. One whale of a lot less traffic! RW>Never been as far south as San Antonio. El Paso to Armarillo and Dallas bef RW>swinging north. My daughter and family live in Houston. If I ever get enou RW>ime to close the shop for a while, I'll be heading that way. I lived in Houston from 62 through 77, then moved here (in a large part because of the traffic in Houston). So I do not envy your daughter and family. Now, S A traffice is worse than Houston traffic was in 77. Can't win for losing! * OLX 2.1 TD * One person's is another's . --- RemoteAccess 2.50+ * Origin: Northern Lights! * San Antonio * 210-499-6299 V34/VFC (1:387/23) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 246 AUTOMOTIVE Ref: EGW00019 Date: 12/25/97 From: JAY EMRIE Time: 06:50pm \/To: ROY J. TELLASON (Read 0 times) Subj: Electrical loads, battery RJT>JAY EMRIE wrote in a message to ALL: RJT> JE> Thought again, No Problem, I'll just disconnect the battery RJT> JE> cable. RJT> JE> Shocker! The blasted thing just sat there and idled and idled RJT> JE> away for about 10 minutes. Proves that the late model cars with RJT> JE> alternators WILL run without a battery. RJT>The problem with this is the potential for damage to computers and other el RJT>nic parts. Try that sometime with a scope on the battery positive line, e RJT>ally if you have one that's got a peak voltage indicator... What else is one to do with the doors locked and the engine running? In retrospect though, when I went in to get my wifes keys, why on earth didn't I then just unlock the door with her key???????? RJT> JE> Also, I have a 550 CCA @ 0 degrees battery/750 CCA at 32 RJT> JE> degrees. RJT>That second number might be "CA", but it _ain't_ CCA, which by definition RJT>t zero degrees. I do NOT know anything except right on the battery it says "550CCA @ 0 degrees, 750 CCA @ 32 degrees". * OLX 2.1 TD * Boycott shampoo! Demand the REAL poo! --- RemoteAccess 2.50+ * Origin: Northern Lights! * San Antonio * 210-499-6299 V34/VFC (1:387/23) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 246 AUTOMOTIVE Ref: EGW00020 Date: 12/25/97 From: JAY EMRIE Time: 09:50pm \/To: ROY WITT (Read 0 times) Subj: Electrical loads, battery RW>22 Dec 97 13:28, JAY EMRIE said this about Electrical loads, battery to OY RW>. RW> RW>> If you look at a schematic of an internally regulated alternator, RW> RW>> you'll see elf-excitation circuit. RW> JE> RW> JE> Roy, I think we are talking about apples and oranges here. APPLES: RW> JE> One statement was that a car would DIE if the battery was RW> JE> disconnected while the engine was running. Not true, and the self RW> JE> exicitation circuit you arte talking about IS there simply because RW> JE> the alternator was providing 12V WHEN the battery was disconnected - RW> JE> thus the self exicitation. ORANGES: The other scenario is when the RW> JE> battery is disconnected and then one tried to pushstart the car. In RW> JE> that case, there would be no self excitation PERIOD - internal OR RW> JE> external regulator. Where would it come from? RW>I've been in this discussion before in the OLDENGINE echo. I lost, defendin RW>e position your taking now. Those old guys over there will ream your butt w RW>the knowledge they have. Been there, done that. Ford alternators, at least those with ammeters, were different in 79 from GM. My point was that ONCE the engine was running, disconnecting the battery did NOT kill the engine as many claimed it should have. Since the alternator was ALREADY putting out 12V that is where the exicitation voltage came from. APPLES In looking at my 92 Ford wiring diagram the alternator has a built in regulator. Probably more like GM but mine is without the idiot light.. ORANGES So far as push starting is concerned, it can't very well be done with an automatic now days. RW>I don't know how Ford alternators work, but GM alternators use the #2 termin RW>onnected to the positive battery terminal to excite the regulator into condu RW>g a current on startup. The #1 terminal is also connected to the positive b RW>ry terminal through a switch and RW>an "idiot light" with a resistor in parallel. My 92 may well present GRAPEFRUIT. I spent 30 minutes trying to determine the instrument panel setup - analog as mine is - and finally gave up; Decided it just wasn't worth it until such time as I HAD to to fix something. Later model wiring diagrams are terribly complicated compared to say 1965 diagrams. RW>As the alternator produces voltage, it appears at the #1 and BAT terminals a RW>he "idiot light" goes out, thus self exciting itself by providing the voltag RW>quired of the zenor in the regulator to turn it on or off. Remove the batter RW>d it will continue to self excite itself. RW>This is where the APPLES and ORANGES come in, if you turn it off and then sp RW>t up again; some alternators will self excite, some won't... RW>... A wok is what you throw at a wabbit. RW>--- RW> * Origin: Bow Tie Racers, Been There, WON That! (1:202/909.13) * OLX 2.1 TD * Figures don't lie, but liars can figure. --- RemoteAccess 2.50+ * Origin: Northern Lights! * San Antonio * 210-499-6299 V34/VFC (1:387/23) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 246 AUTOMOTIVE Ref: EGW00021 Date: 12/25/97 From: JAY EMRIE Time: 09:53pm \/To: ROY WITT (Read 0 times) Subj: Engine Wanted RW>22 Dec 97 13:17, JAY EMRIE said this about Engine Wanted to ROY WITT. RW> RW>> And in California, the DMV made it retroactive to everything made RW> RW>> since 1966 y 1970 Firebird had a vacuum advance kit installed that RW> RW>> wouldn't allow it to ance and the timing reset to 0. RW> JE> RW> JE> The vacuum advance was ONLY ignition timing, the cam grind or rather RW> JE> gear placement on the cam shaft was mechanical timing and could NOT RW> JE> be corrected by ignition timing. RW>Both are ignition timing changes. Stopping vacuum advance and resetting the RW>ition timing to 0 crankshaft...that is, if we're talking about the Firebird What I am trying to say is that the vacuum advance is ignition timing ONLY and the cam gear placement affects both ignition AND valve (mechanical) timing. So when you change the ignition timing ONLY, you have only half done the job. * OLX 2.1 TD * IT WON'T WORK!!! But then neither will I!!! --- RemoteAccess 2.50+ * Origin: Northern Lights! * San Antonio * 210-499-6299 V34/VFC (1:387/23) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 246 AUTOMOTIVE Ref: EGW00022 Date: 12/25/97 From: JAY EMRIE Time: 10:07pm \/To: ROY J. TELLASON (Read 0 times) Subj: Windchill factor RJT>JAY EMRIE wrote in a message to ALL: RJT> JE> The definition of Windchill factor is as follows:(all emphases RJT> JE> mine) RJT> JE> Windchill factor n. The >apparent< temperature felt on the RJT> JE> exposed human body owing to a combination of temperature and RJT> JE> wind speed. RJT> JE> One of the definitions of apparent is: ostensible rather than RJT> JE> actual. RJT> JE> The definition of ostensible is: outwardly >appearing< as such; RJT> JE> professed; pretended. RJT> JE> Absolutely nothing to indicate that the windchill factor RJT> JE> actually< makes the body colder - just that it makes the body RJT> JE> >FEEL< colder. In view of the above definitions (look them up in RJT> JE> any >good< dictionary) all the statements that the windchill RJT> JE> factor makes >anything< actually colder than it really is (by RJT> JE> thermometer measurement) are incorrect! RJT> JE> I will agree, however, IF there >is< external moisture on the RJT> JE> body and the wind blows across the body, the skin temperature RJT> JE> will go down some finite amount UNTIL the external moisture is RJT> JE> evaporated, then the skin will return to its regular RJT> JE> temperature (that is, without external moisture evaporating) - RJT> JE> in other words evaporation DOES cause cooling only so long as RJT> JE> there is something to evaporate. Also, the skin will eventually RJT> JE> reach the temperature of the wind if nothing is done to protect RJT> JE> it - that's how people freeze to death! RJT> JE> Summary. Windchill factor is nothing but a way of expressing RJT> JE> our greater discomfort when it is cold AND the wind is blowing RJT> JE> as opposed to just being the `same cold' without any wind. RJT> JE> Also so much for car radiators getting colder because of RJT> JE> windchill factor. If there is no moisture on the OUTSIDE of the RJT> JE> radiator to evaporate the radiator will not get colder (freeze) RJT> JE> because of windchill factor - but will only get to a certain RJT> JE> temperature because of the actual temperature and the heat RJT> JE> transfer. More air flowing across the radiator will cool the RJT> JE> coolant inside more but the windchill factor has no bearing on RJT> JE> this. RJT>I've wondered about this, too. But heat transfer out of a radiator eems RJT>pend on two factors, one being the difference in temperature between the c RJT>t fluid and the outside (ambient) air, and the other being the rate at whi RJT>r is flowing past that radiator (wind?). I have an air-conditioner that cr True, the heat transfer depends upon the ambient air temp (we'll say 34 degrees) and the air velocity. Regardless of the air velocity it is still just 34 degrees and the coolant in the radiator can't possibly get below 34 degrees - actually no mater HOW fast the air flows through the radiator. RJT> out a while back, the thing would start to work but it seems that this st RJT>little plastic fan that they had on the outside coil broke, right around th RJT>, and the heat transfer out of it just wasn't good enough to let the thing RJT> running. AC is a whole nother ball game. When your condenser fan goes out, you no longer have enough heat transfer from the condensed freon flowing through the condenser coils, therefore when the HOT condensed freon tries to expand when it goes through the evaporator coil it is now too hot to provide enough cooling. RJT>If the evaporation of moisture was the only mechanism that got rid of heat, RJT>n I'd be in total agreement with what you're saying up there, but it isn't RJT>nduction from the radiator to the nearby air also plays into it. When the "nearby" air is only 34 degrees that is as cold as the radiator can possibly get , wind and/or windchill notwithstanding. RJT>I *do* think that while wind chill may have some effect when an engine is h RJT>t doesn't have any bearing whatsoever on what happens when a vehicle is jus RJT>ting there not running. Since the whole thing is at ambient temperature an RJT> there's no difference, and therefore no heat transfer when the wind is b RJT>g. So if you've gottten your antifreeze a bit diluted (trying to find he RJT> ferinstance) and it only protects to 20 degrees F., it could go down o RJT>th real nasty winds and you'd still be okay. RJT>Reaching ambient temperature, though, ain't something that normally happe RJT>th a human body, or at least you sure don't want it to, so in that case y RJT>*always* have to worry about it. And I don't think that the evaporation of RJT>ture comes that much into play in that circumstance either. RJT>email: roy.j.tellason%tanstaaf@frackit.com RJT>--- RJT> * Origin: TANSTAAFL BBS 717-432-0764 (1:270/615) * OLX 2.1 TD * I can write it perfectly; I just don't understand it. --- RemoteAccess 2.50+ * Origin: Northern Lights! * San Antonio * 210-499-6299 V34/VFC (1:387/23) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 246 AUTOMOTIVE Ref: EGW00023 Date: 12/25/97 From: MARC GERGES Time: 11:57am \/To: ALAN MORRISON (Read 0 times) Subj: Mercedes A-Class Salut Alan! AM> November-- After staff members at a Swedish car magazine flipped AM> the much-ballyhooed Mercedes-Benz A-Class last fall, M-B damage AM> control officials went on red alert. First claiming that the AM> A-Class's tires were at fault, Mercedes' engineers admitted defeat AM> on Tuesday, November 11th, deciding to suspend production of the AM> car, retune the A-Class's chassis, and lower its ride height in an AM> effort to make their tall, upright car safer during high-speed AM> direction changes. The so-called 'elk test' describes what an automobilist has to do when he sees an elk on the road - quite an ordinary situation on some skandinavian roads, it seems. It is run at 60 km/h (37mph) and is a double lane change over a distance of 30 m. AM> Ironically, the announcement came only hours before it A-Class was AM> awarded the "Golden Steering Wheel" for the best new car by Bildam AM> Sonntag, a German weekly newspaper. Just to notice, Bild am Sonntag is not a car magazine, it's a rather light gossip newspaper. AM> Mercedes has been praised for their forthright attempt to confront AM> this matter. Not really. AM> Unlike many manufacturers, which traditionally sweep AM> their safety shortcoming under the carpet, Mercedes has made a AM> commitment to keeping their customers informed about the nature of AM> the problem and how they intend to solve it. Mercedes' first reaction was: 'This cannot really be happening'. The second was 'It's the tires, not the car's fault'. Meanwhile every car magazine and TV show tried to tilt the car, and most managed to do so - made a lot of spectacular pictures and videos of the car. Then Mercedes came out and committed they made an error and they'd stop the production to find a solution for the problem. AM> The nearly 2,600 customers that have taken delivery of the AM> A-Class, which went on sale in Europe in mid-October, will be AM> given replacement Mercedes until their cars are fixed. No, they'll only have another car for the 2-3 days it needs to fix their car. AM> In an attempt to further redeem themselves, Mercedes will be AM> fitting all of their A-Class cars with Electronic Slip Protection AM> (ESP) as an added measure of safety. ESP is a traction control AM> system that reduces wheel spin in wet and icy conditions. ESP is in the first place not a traction control, the 's' stands for 'spin'. ESP reduces a car's tendency to spin in a direction change by braking one of the wheels to build a contrary momentum to the one that spins the car round. Mercedes' traction control is called ASR and is part of ESP, as well as ABS (anti lock braking) is. AM> Technology of this level is not typically seen as standard AM> equipment on subcompact cars. Indeed not, but with the A class having it standard, one may expect other compact cars to offer it too in the near future. By the way: ESP is not what stops the new car from tilting. It's bigger wheels, stiffer springs, lower body and thicker anti roll bars that make the difference. Unfortunately they make the car's ride quite hard, too. AM> Nevertheless, the news is bad news for Mercedes and their parent AM> company Daimler-Benz, which touted the A-Class as being as safe as AM> their E-Class sedans. This announcement has already caused AM> financial institutions to lower their expectations of AM> Daimler-Benz's fourth-quarter financial performance, thereby AM> prompting a minor sell-off of Daimler-Benz stock. In fact the new swatch car 'smart', developed by Mercedes, that was planned to go on sale in march 98 was scheduled to october 98 one of these days. Official statement is that the quality is not satisfactory and there are some weakness' in the driving behaviour, but it is known that prototypes not only tilted in the elk test but also rolled over their own nose when braking hard. cu .\\arc ...Commercial Jets have a blackbox, so do most blondes. --- * Origin: sympathy for the debil (2:270/47) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 246 AUTOMOTIVE Ref: EGW00024 Date: 12/24/97 From: ALAN MORRISON Time: 05:26pm \/To: CHRIS ZYCHSKI (Read 0 times) Subj: Daytona -=> Quoting Chris Zychski to Alan Morrison <=- AM>I just can't get used to the headlights and that spoiler off a 70 Dodge AM>Daytona! CZ> Huh?! Dodge Daytona in 1970??? CZ> I musta slept through that one. The original Dodge Daytona was a Charger body with an aero nose attached and a huge rear wing built specifically to have an advantage in NASCAR on the high banked speedways like Daytona. Plymouth had one too, the Superbird as I recall, which had the same add-ons and a big roadrunner graphic on the spoiler strut. These raced in NASCAR with the 426 hemi and were supplied at dealerships to meet the minimum requirements for racing. If you ever saw one of these, you will know what I'm referring to, as they are sort of unique... and very long. --- Blue Wave/386 v2.20 [NR] * Origin: River Canyon Rd. BBS Chattanooga, Tn (1:362/627) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 246 AUTOMOTIVE Ref: EGW00025 Date: 12/24/97 From: ALAN MORRISON Time: 05:39pm \/To: MARK LOGSDON (Read 0 times) Subj: Active Handling -=> Quoting Mark Logsdon to Alan Morrison <=- AM> take delivery of a car equipped with an Active Handling system, but AM> forget about equipping it with magnesium wheels. Standard on export- AM> market Corvettes, the $3,000 wheels were more popular with U.S. buyers AM> than Chevrolet expected. Demand far outstripped supply, so they've been AM> deleted from the 1998 Corvette option list. ML> Now just exactly what is it they're not telling us? They're selling ML> too many wheels and making too much profit, so they're going to quit ML> selling them. Yeah, uh huh. I have wonder why the supply has dried ML> up. Bad design? Poor materials? Quality problems? Disgruntled ML> supplier? Well since it's GM, assume it is something bad if that's your thing. Maybe it is even the case, but since I've read elsewhere that sales have been exceeding expectations, and also since it is surprising that a $3000 option would be a big seller, perhaps it is as reported. Too much profit is no reason to curtail sales. Losing, or delaying a sale because someone is waiting for their car to be shipped with unavailable options is not good business. --- Blue Wave/386 v2.20 [NR] * Origin: River Canyon Rd. BBS Chattanooga, Tn (1:362/627)