--------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 231 RECOVERY Ref: D1I00009 Date: 01/11/96 From: ZITA Time: 06:44pm \/To: RAIN (Read 1 times) Subj: 12 Steps <<< Quoting Rain to Zita Totten >>> R> Thanks for asking, because I'm in really bad physical pain tonight and R> need to remember them: Thanks for the list. I've heard about the 12 steps from alot of people and I wanted to read them. Hopefully the steps will help me in the days to come.Thanks for your time.Keep in touch. Zita. --- GrapeVine BBS v0.23 Reg * Origin: GrapeVine Demonstration BBS - [604-376-9269] (1:353/700) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 231 RECOVERY Ref: D1J00000 Date: 01/14/96 From: WILLIAM KINMOND Time: 12:42am \/To: K.I.S.S. (Read 1 times) Subj: New To Echo K>I agree with you 100%. I'm here as sort of a 'supplemental' thing. I >relocated a while back, and things are *very different* now. I feel >this could be a good way to get back to having the quality of recovery >that I like to maintain. Ya that is very true. I find that I have to make my meetings just to keep what I have and to make sure that I have the good life that I am getting for the first time in a very long time. K>WK> Very soon to have 2 years and very grateful to be here. K>That's great! Ya It think it is also. I hit the date on the 9th of this month and it is great. My kids like there new dad and I am now working on getting my life to smoke free. K>I inadvertantly deleted the Rochester, NY origin line. Do I dare ask >about the weather? Most of my family is in NY, and I know they got a >few feet down in the Poughkeepsie/Beacon area. How did you guys fare? Ok well I think I can sneak this one in here, Well if you like snow and cold you would love it here. We have about 2 foot or more of the white stuff on the ground and more to come. The temp is single numbers at night and less the 30 during the day. Man I miss the desert! Bill * QMPro 1.53 * I can't be wrong; my modem is error-correcting. --- InterEcho 1.16 * Origin: Truck Stop BBS * Rochester, NY (716) 235-0992 (1:2613/403) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 231 RECOVERY Ref: D1J00001 Date: 01/11/96 From: CHRISTIAN HEDEMARK Time: 02:23am \/To: RAIN (Read 1 times) Subj: Hello again RA>Yes, I'm one of them. This echo has no strong-language rule, however, so RA>if profanity bothers you, you may continue to be be uncomfortable with RA>some of the posts here, including mine. Sorry. RA>Easy. Close your eyes and imagine the taste of steamed, buttered corn RA>that went into the pot straight off the stalk. I never did well with corn. Tomato's, peppers, stringbeans, zuchinni, all did well. But my LAST garden..!!!!! I went away for a weekend. In preparation, I popped a beer, put the hose on the garden for a long soak, since I would be gone, popped a beer, went in the house, popped.... get it? When I got home on Sunday night, there were flashing lights and road signs around my house. My hose had been on a couple of 24 hours, and the highway behind my house was flooded. The plants did not do well that year. They drowned. Around 1986-7. RA>-> shitty, RA>-> OH! Rain! RA>-> RA>their foreheads, if not their dicks. RA>-> (blush) RA>-> (am I taking inventory???? sorry) RA>Yes. Please stop. 10th Step Time - I'm sorry. After I uploaded it, I realized I don't know you well enough to comment. I'm glad I was gentle. Love --- OLX 2.1 TD Try "As Bill Sees It" Page 3, third reading. --- GOMail v1.1 [92-0421] * Origin: SeekNet(tm) International (215)237-6628 1:2614/402 (1:273/412) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 231 RECOVERY Ref: D1J00002 Date: 01/11/96 From: CHRISTIAN HEDEMARK Time: 02:25am \/To: RAIN (Read 1 times) Subj: Hello! RA>-> Rain! I've seen your name a number of times, but thought it was a bit RA>-> whifty and left you alone. RA>I don't know what "whifty" is, or why my name would dictate RA>whether you talk to me or not...please elaborate. It sounds like a back-to-nature late 60's hippy name. I still have a hard time getting out of that mode. RA>Why would I want to change a name based on a marvelous, transformative RA>spiritual experience and one of the most beautiful and powerful RA>phenomena of the natural world? Never thought of it that way. You're right! Bye --- OLX 2.1 TD Try "As Bill Sees It" Page 3, third reading. --- GOMail v1.1 [92-0421] * Origin: SeekNet(tm) International (215)237-6628 1:2614/402 (1:273/412) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 231 RECOVERY Ref: D1J00003 Date: 01/11/96 From: CHRISTIAN HEDEMARK Time: 04:12am \/To: PSAPPHO (Read 1 times) Subj: Who is God Re: PS> DS> Cant fight life is to short and besides how can you PS> DS> fight with your brothers and sisters in Christ.....And PS> DS> love being the greatest of gifts. PS> DS> Hope you had a great Christmas and a sane New years. PS> DS> I did. Santa was good to me....I had surgery on my PS> DS> neck in Oct. and the healing process went great. PS> DS> I feel like a new man. God has worked a miracle in my PS> DS> life. I suffered from severe pain for over four years PS> DS> and now NO PAIN. NO MORE PAIN MEDICINE....... PS> DS> Keep the faith and makes no difference male or female, PS> DS> Jew or Gentile we are all the same in the Lords eyes. PS> DS> But he did make Man in His image. Love to you and PS> DS> yours and hope you have a great 1996.... Hey Psappho - I used to feel about this stuff the same way you do! Now I'm different (thank God!) Recovery is a program of change. Who knows how we will think next month? If God, & love, and miracles etc. are offensive to you, well.... Live & Let Live. Easy Does It. And please........Keep Coming Back! PS> Christ is nothing but some myth strung up for idiots who can not think or PS>themselves. ITs a selfish religion that teaches hate and blood. Its about PS>human sacrafice and torture. It teaches canabalism and your so called ove PS>Christ is nothing but bigotry and incest. It openly teaches that its alrigh PS>for parents to leave children for familys to be broken up, for people to e PS>killed or any other act as long as the act is going to bring the indivdiuals PS>closer to the salvation of their souls. MORE people have been killed in the PS>name of Jesus than by Hitler. It is an evil and vile religion and you ill PS>gladly keep it out of my face! I do NOT go around sticking my religion n PS>your face and I will not have you wasting my space and personally nsulting PS>with your ugly bloody and hateful religion. Gosh - do you sound just like I used to ! Love --- OLX 2.1 TD Try "As Bill Sees It" Page 3, third reading. --- GOMail v1.1 [92-0421] * Origin: SeekNet(tm) International (215)237-6628 1:2614/402 (1:273/412) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 231 RECOVERY Ref: D1J00004 Date: 01/11/96 From: CHRISTIAN HEDEMARK Time: 04:43am \/To: PSAPPHO (Read 1 times) Subj: Who is God PS> 1. My religion, my self and all who I love have been victumized PS> by the christian church because of our beliefs. I submit: Not by "The" christian church. But by "Some" churche(s). There is not a "the" which represents all. Example: if one had a rotton experience with someone(s) in recovery, they would not be correct in being prejudiced against YOU - right? No one or two or three people can represent our 12 step program. As they say... some are sicker than others. Your early life exposed you to the sickies, not the "Christ-Likes". PS> 2. christians in this program have made my recovery harder than PS> I believe it should be. I'm sorry. I may have been guilty of that with others. I have been trying to share experience, strength & hope. PS> 3. I resent not being able to go to meetings ect without being PS> offended by it * in the context of the meetings * not in the PS> sharing of the individuals Resentments are a problem for most people in recovery. You're normal then. That too will pass. The 12 step programs are rooted in the Christian background, though it is backpedeled. That won't pass. You may have to utilize the Serenity Prayer (whoops! a prayer!) to live with the program. PS> 4. On a personal level my family was torn apart by the church.. PS> IE - church first to hell with your children Sounds like a dysfunctional family or church. Be slow to condemn the "functional" on the basis of your bad experiences with the "dysfunctional". PS> 5. I was physically and verbally abused as a child in the name of PS> christ. My mother would beat me untill her arm got tired then PS> she would either lock me in a closet or the basement over night PS> or/and then demand that I ask Jesus to forgive me for my sin. I PS> generally do not mention this in public because after its made PS> mention of then ANYTHING I say after that is attributed to this. I am sorry. Jesus would not approve of what happened to you. As you said... it was your mother that did this. It was not Jesus. He probably wept for you. PS> My point is not that I am justified when I flame rather than just hit he You are justified in being hurt, and mad, at..... someone. PS>that their religion can and has done, it still remains that they do know the Their religion has not done anything to you. The actions of some sick individuals in your past is what harmed you. PS>not my intention now, nor has it EVER been my intention to upset this echo t I'm not upset about what you've done, but what was done to you. PS>on. It would be no different than if a pro-nazi indivdual was on the same PS>echo with a survivor of the holocost.... My Grandfather was the one who Recognize that a pro-German is not a pro-Nazi. Your feelings about Chritians is akin to hating all Germanic peoples. PS>ordained Jim Jones. I remember the storys of him beating his daughters unti PS>they would bleed because he caught them wearing silk stockings. Now I have This is not the teaching of Jesus. PS>generally stayed out of this echo. NOT because I felt like I was violated b PS>because I did not want to be a source of problems. Perhaps it would be bett PS>if I kept it that way.... I am not sure... if I were I would not be aking PS>the time to type this response. PS> In all honesty I could see you were being honest, before you said so. I wish I could help. Please don't resent my comments. Love - really. --- OLX 2.1 TD In, not of, in, not of, in, not of, in... --- GOMail v1.1 [92-0421] * Origin: SeekNet(tm) International (215)237-6628 1:2614/402 (1:273/412) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 231 RECOVERY Ref: D1J00005 Date: 01/13/96 From: LINDA GLOVER Time: 08:26am \/To: HARRIET LEVY (Read 1 times) Subj: Re: MSG BELOW WAS ...... > Right...and today she had the nerve to complain that her legs were > sore from taking a too long bike ride. > The nerve of some poeple. You get them sober, and then they > start having FUN....Sheesh...you think they'd know beter ;-) > BTW, I heard, tonight, that they're expecting a possibility of > 10 more inches of snow on Friday. With any luck I might get > snowed out of New York.....I can think of worse places to get > stranded. Let's see, warm weather, sunshine, a computer....and.... > Who could ask for more? > I know, I'm entirely *too* happy ;-) Heard that the weather was setting records out there for the highs...geeze!!! Not fair at all!!! But really glad you're having a good time, Gal!!! As for being *too* happy, ENJOY!!!! Like I've told you before...YOU DESERVE IT!!!! Did you hear that one :-)!!!!? Today is the first time in a month or better that I've been able to get outside to walk. Could do it in Florida, but it's bee toooooo cold here. Supposed to get into the 50s today...HEATWAVE!:-0!!! () Linda --- DB 1.54/004780 * Origin: The Bearly Bored HST 314-581-6717 1:289/1 (1:289/1) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 231 RECOVERY Ref: D1J00006 Date: 01/14/96 From: KURT J. TISCHER Time: 05:14am \/To: ALL (Read 1 times) Subj: Just need to vent Hello All, Well, today was a very interesting day and charged with some unfavorable incidents. My girlfriend and I were out looking for a place to eat, when seemingly from out of nowhere, her X pulls up in front of me, cuts me off so I can't go forward, and cars were behind so I couldn't back up. The man then proceeds to get out of his car, runs over and opens my door and starts bashing me in the head, screaming about how I took her away from him and that if he ever saw me with her again, he'd kill me. I'm not a fighter and I have no quarrel with this man, so I just tried to keep covered. She kept telling him to leave me alone, as did I, and then told me she was going to go with him, knowing that might get him to stop. I screamed, "Fine, go with him then." Well, he wouldn't let up, even after she got out of my car and she got in front of my door to try and push it shut and get him out. She finally gave up and started running down the street, at which point he went after her in his car. I think she went with him. I don't know why. This guy has physically abused her in the past. Because of traffic, I couldn't catch up. I lost both of them. After searching for a couple of minutes, I gave up and went to file a police report for A&B. They told me when I got to the station that someone had called about the incident and they dispatched a cruiser. Too bad they were late. The sad part about it all is that the three of us are in the program. I've been clean & sober for 4 years, she and her X for about 8 years. I understand the hurt this guy must feel, but I don't think I would ever intentionally harm anyone, let alone anyone in the program. This all happened at about 6pm. It is now 4am and I haven't been able to get in touch with her and I have not been able to get calm enough to sleep. Although we have been seeing each other for six months, there was a chance that they were going to reconcile and get back together. In a way, I kinda think he blew that chance out the door tonight, but I don't know. For those of you who've had similar situations, please give me your insights and opinions, both male and female. Thanks, Kurt P.S. I am NOT going to drink over this, though I am very distressed. -=- * CMPQwk #1.42-R2 * UNREGISTERED EVALUATION COPY --- SLMAIL v4.5a (#4334) * Origin: 3RD EAR BBS - Middleburg Heights, Ohio - 216-234-6088 (1:157/438) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 231 RECOVERY Ref: D1J00007 Date: 01/13/96 From: MIKE JOHNSTON Time: 07:39pm \/To: TOM ANDERSON (Read 1 times) Subj: FOR YOUR INFO... 2/2 TA> Hello Mike! TA> TA> In a message to Tom Anderson <01/10/96> Mike Johnston wrote: TA> TA> TA>Hi Mike, There is also another echo around here someplace call TA> MJ> >Meeting after.... Which let us say just about anything we wan TA> MJ> >Just like the coffee clutch after a meeting. The only basic TA> MJ> >is be nice and don't fight (G) you might want to add this on TA> MJ> >your mail reader also. Thanks I will look for this and see if it is there. Thanks for the help. TA> MJ> TA> MJ> TA> MJ> Besides here I call long distance to a bbs called Serenity an TA> MJ> another one called 12 Steps. !@ steps is in Philadelphia and Ser TA> MJ> in Shamokin, Pa. TA> TA> TA> The traffic is not heavy in that echo and shouldn't cost more to TA> get it. It's on the backbone so should be available to you. One TA> day at a time. (G) TA> TA> Keep Commin Back !!! TomA TA> TA> ... Dating is like Geometry: If you've got the curves, I've g TA> TA> --- WILDMAIL!/WC v4.12 TA> * Origin: Michi ana Online, Michigan City, IN (1:230/15.0) --- TriToss (tm) Professional 10.0 - #200 * Origin: Stimpy's Sandbox | 717.730.8504 (1:270/722.0) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 231 RECOVERY Ref: D1J00008 Date: 01/13/96 From: GUIDO Time: 08:12am \/To: CHRISTIAN HEDEMARK (Read 1 times) Subj: Bill W. Sobriety Date -==- Hi Christian.. CH>Remember this when "cross addicted" people come to AA and mention other CH>substances "only in passing". Bill W. used & talked about it for 5 CH>years (1954-59). there's one simple fact you're not considering here though... most of those people objecting to cross-addictions inside the rooms today only read two books; the Big Book and the Twelve and Twelve... the rest of the books available just don't fit into their recovery program... they are content with reading tradition three and thinking that people with cross-addictions should form their own group... so when you hear someone inside the meetings talking down about the cross-addicted people, remember that they are the ones with the real problem not the ones coming in to find a better way of life... most of the old-timers I've encountered who have read a lot of materials don't have ill feelings toward the cross-addicted people... they're just happy to know that they are aware that they have a problem and want something better out of life... take care __-==-__ --- * WR 1.31 # 675 * "Mr. Worf, fire phasers at CHRISTIAN" ... Zzzzzap! * Origin: Ruby's Joint BBS 904.777.6799 (1:112/129)