--------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 231 RECOVERY Ref: C5C00008 Date: 05/06/95 From: ROSLYN REID Time: 07:50pm \/To: DR. BILL (Read 3 times) Subj: Spring Cleaning DB> Yeah, moving from Akron, OH to the middle of the desert was a DB> pretty big change. I think of it as my last geographic. at least until you're ready to play "can you top this?" DB> Sometimes I miss Akron, for sure I miss the friends that I have DB> there. I don't miss the cold winters though but it makes me DB> wonder sometimes which is worse, a real cold winter or 120 plus DB> in the shade;-) why not move to the midwest, where you can have BOTH? :D DB> Silence is something that gives me problems. Almost always there DB> is some sort of noise running in my place, you know, the radio or i think we are all in that situation these days...it's more of a pollution problem than anyone realizes. DB> the TV, anything for the noise. When I want silence, I go out in DB> the desert and listen to the silence of the Spirit. It is a DB> different kind of silence, it is not the absence of noise but DB> rather the sounds of peace and harmony. That must sound pretty DB> strange, I sometimes have a difficult time putting words to what I DB> feel, this is one of those times. no, i know just what you mean because of my practice of yoga. the noises are still there, but they are not intrusive. they belong, so to speak, & so do not jar or annoy you. DB> How true, Thoreau once said; "I never found the companion that was DB> so companionable as solitude." While there is great value in wasnt his brother a drunk or something? (maybe that's why he moved to the woods!) DB> enjoying one's solitude, too much of it can do more harm than good DB> if you know what I mean. The way I am feeling right now is that yeah, i think my brother's in that position right now. keeping everyone at arm's length--and he has a LONG arm! when things dont go right for him, he doesnt wanna talk to anyone. but that can only make matters worse for him. DB> I would really just like to spend some time with someone who DB> enjoys a good book or can play a good game of chess while sitting jeez louise, i cant remember the last time i played chess... DB> on the riverbank watching the sun go down. I don't seem to be DB> able to find many folks like that lately. O well... You take DB> care now. you too brother bill. --- MegaMail 2.10 #0 --- Olms 2.01 [RTTAD4CG] * Origin: The Back Door BBS Richmond VA 804-264-2107 28.8k (1:264/165) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 231 RECOVERY Ref: C5C00009 Date: 05/06/95 From: ROSLYN REID Time: 07:50pm \/To: STEPHEN HARRIS (Read 3 times) Subj: Step by Step... SH> I see you are still keeping this echo cheerful. I have to admit SH> being concerned when you asked for that AIDS information. Though it's just so i can find info for healthwork with PWAs (people with aids). SH> far be it from me to admit making inferences from some of your post SH> just because there is a phone number for a Rosyln in every restroom SH> of every bar I have ever been into West of the Mississippi. hmm...i thought you were staying outta those places, or i wouldnt have put my number there! SH> The most I ever paid for beer was $20 for a six-pack and that was wow. well, over in pennsy, you cant buy a 6-pack--you have to buy a case! (it used to be quite a beer-producing state.) SH> I certainly hope you are enjoying life. I read you like Ann Landers a nice sensible missou-rah girl. SH> Your Amigo, as skunk sez, "if your ego is not your amigo, it stinks!" SH>... "Mr. Worf, fire phasers at Roslyn" ... Zzzzzap! heehee--my shields were up! --- MegaMail 2.10 #0 --- Olms 2.01 [RTTAD4CG] * Origin: The Back Door BBS Richmond VA 804-264-2107 28.8k (1:264/165) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 231 RECOVERY Ref: C5C00010 Date: 05/06/95 From: ROSLYN REID Time: 07:50pm \/To: RICHARD E. ROBBINS (Read 3 times) Subj: Step by Step... RE>Well, I was just up there Saturday night, and it was six dollars a beer. jeez louise. RE>buy a 2.50 pop. Not much better price wise, but I think a much better ch RE>than the beer.... i agree...i even order water when i can get away with it! RE>One has to pick and choose the words you use... (hey that rhymes!!!) Any argh. so clever. RE>can see by some messages on this and other bases how people can and will RE>the limits of civility. I'm guilty in that respect, but I'm better now. RE>learning, as a matter of fact. life is full of AFGEs. (another f*ing growth experience) --- MegaMail 2.10 #0 --- Olms 2.01 [RTTAD4CG] * Origin: The Back Door BBS Richmond VA 804-264-2107 28.8k (1:264/165) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 231 RECOVERY Ref: C5C00011 Date: 05/06/95 From: ROSLYN REID Time: 07:50pm \/To: MELISSA REED (Read 3 times) Subj: worse??? MR>Fortunately, no children involved. I do not look upon her getting MR>arrested as the end of everything. Something like this was bound to MR>happen sooner or later. sometimes it really seems inevitable! MR>our office and a few of us were watching. One co-worker (my cousin) MR>knew about my sister and remarked to him that if I knew one of those MR>cops was the arresting officer in my sisters case I would go out and MR>thank him. We both got a good chuckle. MR>I am writing a contract where she transfers her share of the home to me legal-type, with an attorney, etc? MR>and includes other stipulations regarding her lifestyle-cleanliness, MR>friends, etc. I will have keys to the home and do inspections and MR>when I deem she is responsible enough to handle it will start returning MR>property, after I'm paid for any money it has cost me plus interest- MR>friends are friends, family is family but business is business. BTW she i hope this doesnt last long, tho. any involvement at all only increases the enmeshment you now find yourself in. MR> RR> so, your sister at least has a role model. maybe she'll use it. MR> MR>Hmmm, don't want to be a role model and am not qualified. I helped a it's really something we have no choice in... MR>with life. He has turned his life around and rather than me telling my MR>sister how great sobriety is (she may think I have ulterior motives MR>other than her well being) he is going to talk to her. They have known MR>each other for years so we'll see. hope she listens! MR>Yes, I understand that. It is just that I know how miserable, hopeless, MR>scared she feels right now. I know her fate is out of my hands and sure, you can sympathize. just protect yourself from any chain-yanking. MR> RR> "hope she wakes up"? you really are an optimist, huh? MR> MR>Yes, I just like that half full glass. it's half full of WHAT that counts! MR>The thud has happened now just see which way she bounces. If, in my it's a hard thing to watch, but sometimes that's the best way to help. MR>opinion and after a long talk, she is trying (and staying clean) I will MR>help and if she tries to snow me or is not trying I will withdraw MR>assistance and tell her I'll see her at one of our funerals. whew! best wishes to ya. MR>Frankly, I really don't care what she thinks about me right now-I want now THAT'S the spirit! MR>go and I told him I was ok. I wasn't crying for her, necessarly, but MR>for all the people that have lost control of their lives thru substance MR>abuse. I know how miserable that is. I told him I wish there was a way yeah...me too...it sux. MR>say she has cost me a considerable sum of cash the last years plus a lot MR>of worrying. well, let's hope that is all over now, & that your new approach will be effective. MR>At least if she does what I say (no options I can see) she will have a MR>home and in a few years if I think she is ready and she has a drivers that's a nice way to provide. you're doing your best here! MR>license I can co-sign for a car. When I got out of halfway house I had MR>enough money for one months rent on a small (not too nice) apartment, 2 MR>jobs (minimum wage) and a determination to do as well as I could. the determination is the important part. :) MR>VBG-did that yesterday in the middle of a highway coming back from MR>seeing my cousin, his wife, his mother and the house-just screamed for a MR>while and then on home. haha! the car is great for such things--privacy! MR>Huggs and thank you for the input back atcha! good luck. --- MegaMail 2.10 #0 --- Olms 2.01 [RTTAD4CG] * Origin: The Back Door BBS Richmond VA 804-264-2107 28.8k (1:264/165) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 231 RECOVERY Ref: C5C00012 Date: 05/06/95 From: ROSLYN REID Time: 07:50pm \/To: MICHAEL SIGAL (Read 3 times) Subj: Your MSG MS>I'm talking about the master list of ALL FIDONET NODES...1,700K document MS>compressed...3,700K expanded near 2,000 pages....lists all current fido MS>nodes with telephone log on #....It's called NODELIST.ZIP yeah, i have that...but wouldja believe my LD bill for calling VA is about 50 cents for twice a week...and the closest BBS in NJ would STILL be LD! --- MegaMail 2.10 #0 --- Olms 2.01 [RTTAD4CG] * Origin: The Back Door BBS Richmond VA 804-264-2107 28.8k (1:264/165) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 231 RECOVERY Ref: C5D00000 Date: 05/08/95 From: THOM R. Time: 01:37am \/To: ALL (Read 4 times) Subj: The St. Francis Prayer Just thought I'd post this wonderful prayer for the fun of it... Lord, make me a channel of thy peace, that where there is hatred, I may bring love; that where there is wrong, I may bring the spirit of forgiveness; that where there is discord, I may bring harmony; that where there is error, I may bring truth; that where there is doubt, I may bring faith; that where there is despair, I may bring hope; that where there are shadows, I may bring light; that where there is sadness, I may bring joy. Lord, grant that I may seek rather to comfort than to be comforted; to understand, than to be understood; to love, than to be loved. For it is by self-forgetting that one finds. It is by forgiving that one is forgiven. It is by dying that one awakens to Eternal Life. Amen. () Thom ... Not one shread of evidence exists to the idea that life must be serious. ___ TagDude 0.84 [Unregistered] --- MakeMsg v2.31 * Origin: Thom's ASCII Connection...via Thom's Campfire... (1:102/749.1) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 231 RECOVERY Ref: C5D00001 Date: 05/08/95 From: THOM R. Time: 01:44am \/To: ALL (Read 3 times) Subj: STORY: "Now We Are Thousands" From the 9th Printing of the 1st Edition of the Big Book... NOW WE ARE THOUSANDS WHEN this book appeared in April 1939 there were approximately 100 A.A. members. Two thirds of them were at Akron, Ohio, or nearby communities in the northern part of that state. Most of the remainder were in or near New York City and a few others were scattered along the Atlantic Seaboard. The work had then been in existence over four years. It had been satisfactorily demonstrated that at least two out of three alcoholics who wished to get well could apparently do so, notwithstanding the fact that their chance of recovery upon any other medical or spiritual basis had been almost nil-a small percentage at best. Publication of the book, which set down our experience and methods at length, opened a new and unexplored phase which meant an attempt to carry the work to other localities, widespread publicity, and the exposure of our methods to the test of approval or disapproval by religion, medicine, and the general public-an uncharted field indeed. Would theologians complain of our lack of orthodoxy? Would physicians frown upon the idea of banding together great numbers of alcoholics for mutual aid through a spiritual common denominator? Would reviewers and columnists ridicule the spiritual content of the work, thus prejudicing the men and women we were trying to help? Would alcoholic men and women and their families be convinced by the book and the attendant publicity that here at last was a solution? Such were the uncertainties of April 1939. Remarkable as it may seem none of these anticipated difficulties has materialized. Clergymen of all faiths, Catholic, Protestant and Jewish, have united in generous approval of our activities. The Christian Science Monitor gave this book a favorable editorial review. Physicians who have observed us at close range are almost unanimous in their opinion that our methods are sound and the results most promising. Best of all is the fact that alcoholics and their familes seize upon this book, perceive its practical application to their problems, and often take action by writing to The Alcoholic Foundation Office (Box 459, Grand Central Annex, New York 17) inquiring how they may get in touch with the nearest A.A. center, or asking directions for starting groups in their own communities. Innumerable inquiries have been answered by personal letter, relating those anxious to get well to the nearest A.A. membership. In notable instances The Alcoholic Foundation * has fostered the creation of new centers about enthusiastic alcoholics who have derived their inspiration from the book alone. In some cases the book has acted as a specific for alcoholism, for we are in touch with men who have worked out their own recovery by simply following out the suggestions of the book. Besides maintaining a correspondence with new people, our central office keeps in touch with men who have recovered in established centers, who travel to other communities, or who find employment in new places. Such individuals turn up sooner or later where new groups are in process of formation contributing to their success and relating them to the older memberships. When it is considered that we have increased one hundred fold in the last five years and when it is remembered that we are growing by a sort of geometrical progression, each alcoholic as a part of his own treatment working with others, one begins to ask how far A.A. may go. Though we alcoholics are plagued with over active imaginations, we shall surely have thousands of new members every year. Then, too, it should be remembered that for each alcoholic three or four other persons are vitally affected spiritually as well as economically. Even now it is evident that these collateral benefits of our work are large. Cleveland, Ohio, is an interesting example. In the Fall of 1939 approximately 25 Cleveland alcoholics were attending meetings with the already large group at Akron, Ohio. The Cleveland Plain Dealer ran a series of articles on A.A. featuring them upon its editorial page. A rapid and successful growth ensued. This community has many active groups totaling hundreds of alcoholic men and women. This activity includes perhaps thousands of additional individuals-families, employers, and friends, who say they have been vitally touched and benefited. Suppose several thousand alcoholics, most of them able and energetic men and women coming from all walks of life, eventually recover. Surely the effect upon this city would be potent. There is another aspect of our activity which has often been overlooked. Though no accurate census has been taken, it is probable that 90% of active A.A. members are now employed. Most of them reestablished themselves economically with no other help than we give each other. We believe we have demonstrated that when an individual commences to think straight and elects a sound spiritual basis for his life, he will presently find a way to maintain himself. This spiritual principle, which looks to many people like threadbare rationalization, seems to be practically proven by our employment record. The simple arithmetic of the situation tells the story. One might elaborate for pages upon what has taken place in the past few years. Stories of spectacular recoveries, of intense spiritual experiences, of happy social contacts, of regained health, of hundreds who have returned to their churches, of families reunited, of seemingly impossible differences composed, of renewed bnsiness success; such narratives might be set down by scores. Nor should we fail to mention other hundreds who have quietly stopped drinking and resumed normal life. We could also tell of heartbreaking failures, of seeing those for whom we have formed great attachments continue to disintegrate before our eyes. Such is the warp and woof of A.A. erywhere. * See appendix I-We invite correspondence. () Thom ... Learn to forgive yourself, again and again and again and again. ___ TagDude 0.84 [Unregistered] --- MakeMsg v2.31 * Origin: Thom's ASCII Connection...via Thom's Campfire... (1:102/749.1) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 231 RECOVERY Ref: C5E00000 Date: 05/07/95 From: DONNA SWANSON Time: 08:23pm \/To: WES FITZSIMMONS (Read 3 times) Subj: easier or better? Wes, First: about Readers. To be honest, I have a reader which is supposed to be very good but I just haven't configured something right. It dials my BBS. I can hear the telephone connection buzzing and humming but after 30-40 seconds it disconnects. I haven't played with it for about 3 weeks. And since I last mentioned the lack of a Reader I figured out how to download posts from this conference; so at least I don't have to tie up my phone line all evening. I just don't have the capability to cut and paste quotes that I need to refer to. (Or I might even be able to do that but just haven't figured that out yet.) I think my QuickLink II has a built-in reader but the manual is so difficult for me to understand. Progress--not perfection! You said: ...I'm reminded of the 11th tradition. No one person or group represents the program. .....I am a member of a fellowship, but I am not to be the fellowship. That reminded me that there is a big difference between fellowship and program. People and our relationships that develop as a result of AA meetings (internet or face to face) are the fellowship and I'm extremely grateful for that. However, I do believe I could stay sober without the fellowship. I don't want to try that but could if I had to...just like the loners. BUT I also know I could *not* stay sober without the program: the 12 steps of Alcoholic Anonymous...regardless of how much fellowship I participated in. Thanks for writing to me. Your concern and your input was most helpful. Keep trudgin' this road of happy destiny. Love, Donna (donna.swanson@megasystem.com) --- FidoPCB v1.4 [ff097/x] * Origin: MegaSystem - 702-359-2666 - (1:213/830) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 231 RECOVERY Ref: C5E00001 Date: 05/07/95 From: DONNA SWANSON Time: 08:23pm \/To: ED KASKY (Read 3 times) Subj: Re: 12 steps for CPU Anon Ed, I'm glad you received the CPU 12 steps....Enjoy! Donna --- FidoPCB v1.4 [ff097/x] * Origin: MegaSystem - 702-359-2666 - (1:213/830) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 231 RECOVERY Ref: C5E00002 Date: 05/08/95 From: STEPHEN HARRIS Time: 04:51pm \/To: ROSLYN REID (Read 4 times) Subj: Re: Juggling Balances -=> Quoting Roslyn Reid to Stephen Harris <=- RR> a nice sensible missou-rah girl. Oh. I can picture you sitting in a sewing circle mending a quilt. Perhaps discussing Dion Fortune and gateways to the nether realms. SH> Your Amigo, RR> as skunk sez, "if your ego is not your amigo, it stinks!" I am getting absent-minded. Did I mention Kindness, Clarity, Insight by the Dalai Lama? He mentions mindfulness. Eastern philosopy tends to focus on eliminating the ego. Western tends to integrate it. I'm reading Fractals, Chaos, and Power Laws by Manfred Schroeder which is why I can't remember if I have lost my mind. Life is funny. I got a D in HS physics and joined the Navy at 17 before calculus. Still have some unicorns around home though with pictures of Merlin and his pet familiar, an owl named Archimedes. The palmtree pigeons ignore him. Which means I have to wash the car more than I would like. It doesn't seem fair that everyone else is enjoying serenity, whilst poor me hast to worry about dishpan hands. That palm also has dates to sweep up! Well, enough of my problems. The Promises will come true someday. I used to live in Sandston, VA, near the airfield named Friendship? RR> ! Origin: The Back Door BBS Richmond VA 804-264-2107 28.8k Also usta work as a bookkeeper. But my scissors lost verisimilitude. So I became a probability analyst with less stress on accuracy. Happy Mother's Day if you happen to have a pet. Called mine yesterday. Justa trudgin along, Maverick Stephen, AZ ... Unicorns sidestep issues, teetering MerryGoRounds on tottering swings. --- FE 1.41+ We be Jamm'n here! * Origin: To Have Peace, Teach Peace to Learn It. (1:300/25)