--------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 221 UFO Ref: F4K00004 Date: 04/17/98 From: PATRICK FORD Time: 03:28am \/To: LAURIE APPLETON (Read 1 times) Subj: No more lies, please In a message of 14 Apr 98 Laurie Appleton wrote to David Bloomberg: LA> Yes indeed, and just look at the "industry" that has "sprung up LA> around" Darwin's evolutionary theory too. That has been a wonderful LA> money spinner for 'scholarly speculations', hasn't it! Yes, like all 19th century science- physics, chemistry, and all of them. That industry is called education and has made possible such things as computers. I don't think many teachers really regard their profession as a great money spinner. Darwins theories are not really part of modern science any more than Lavoisier's or Cavendish's. Why aren't you railing against electrical engineers and scientists of last century? They got /much/ more wrong than Darwin did. Will you demand that engineers stop using Newtonian mechanics to design buildings and bridges, since Einsiein showed Newton had it wrong? LA> Maybe with the demise of Darwinism in recent years the credulous are LA> turning to other things like this eh? The demise of Darwinism was complete many years ago. All Darwin did was propose a theory. Most of the detail has been modifieded and will continue to be; that's how science works. Evolution is a fact, like gravity and light. Its not disputable. All 19th century science has been found to have been incomplete; that's how science works. There is no such thing as Darwinism so stop fightng a ghost. LA> Genesis seems more and more probable after all! No. The only way you can show proof or evidence for Genesis is by telling deliberate lies, as that guy did with Noahs Ark. I just hope you have the sense to ask God for forgiveness for telling lies before Satan, the Prince of Liars owns you completely. _patrick_ (email: patrick.ford@amiga.gen.nz) Team *Amiga* --- Spot 1.3a #1649 * Origin: ====Patrick Ford====Auckland, NEW ZEALAND=====Fidonet: (3:772/235.3) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 221 UFO Ref: F5G00000 Date: 04/05/98 From: MATTHEW SCRUGGS Time: 08:05am \/To: ALL (Read 0 times) Subj: Roswell Anatomy. ( Con'td. CUFOS Timeline.) Thursday, July 10, 1947. AM. As he reads the morning newspaper, Bill Brazel learns about his father's activities in Roswell. Realizing no one will be at the ranch, he makes plans to get down there to help. ( Randle & Schmitt, 1994. p. 171.) ******* Later. At the debris field and impact site men are working to get everything cleaned up. They want nothing left and no signs of their presence. ( Ibid. p. 172.) ******* Military personel return to Sheriff Wilcox's office and ask for the box of debris he has been storing for them. Wilcox surrenders it without protest. ( Ibid.) ******* Mac Brazel is being held in the guest house on the base. The officers are still trying to convince him not to say anything about what he has seen. They are also trying to keep him out of the way of reporters. He is given a physical by doctors at the base hospital. ( Ibid.) ******* Sherrif Wilcox calls Glenn Dennis's father, telling him that his son has gotten into trouble out at the base . The sheriff has been visited by a seargent who wants to ensure Dennis's silence. ( Ibid.) ******* Major W.D. Priichard from Alamogordo claims that a unit from his base in Roswell launched balloons around june 14th. That, according to the article reported in the Roswell Daily Record is undoubtedly what Brazel had found. ( Ibid.) ( To be con.) --- Platinum Xpress/386/Wildcat! v1.3 * Origin: The Disk Fix * Maryville, Tn * 423-983-8232 * (1:3615/5) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 221 UFO Ref: F5G00001 Date: 04/11/98 From: JACK SARGEANT Time: 11:51pm \/To: BOB KING (Read 0 times) Subj: Mars "face" > Have you decoded the picture I sent you from pathfinder and if so > what do you make of it? > You might like to send a copy to Ross also and see what his opinion > is. I couldn't get it to decode. Is it the same one that was on the NASA web site? js --- FMail 1.22 * Origin: -=Keep Watching the Skies=- Email to: ufo1@juno.com (1:379/12) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 221 UFO Ref: F5G00002 Date: 04/12/98 From: PATRICK FORD Time: 10:36am \/To: BOB KING (Read 0 times) Subj: Mars "face" In a message of 11 Apr 98 Bob King wrote to me: BK> From your comments you obviously have a lot of reservations about what BK> may or may not be on mars etc. BK> Do you have the ability to unencode a picture and then view it etc? BK> If so let me know and will netmail you a copy for you perusal and No problem, Bob, send when you're ready.. -patrick --- Spot 1.3a #1649 * Origin: ====Patrick Ford====Auckland, NEW ZEALAND=====Fidonet: (3:772/235.3) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 221 UFO Ref: F5G00003 Date: 04/13/98 From: PATRICK FORD Time: 01:43am \/To: DAVID BLOOMBERG (Read 0 times) Subj: Mars "face" In a message of 11 Apr 98 David Bloomberg wrote to me: PF>> I don't think Hoagland has fantasies, except perhaps about next year's PF>> skimmings from the gullible. I think he is a hard headed businessman PF>> who saw a market need and exploited it, the same as Walt Disney did. DB> ^^^^ DB> I'm not sure I'd agree that being bamboozled is really a "need" of the DB> market. An opening, yes, but not a need. In the cynical world of marketing, a need is defined as an opening or opportunity. But if you have a look in your newsagent at the loony fringe press, you may come to the conclusion that the consumers of that sort of stuff do in fact feel a need. How else can you explain the proliferation of $3.99 per minute phone lines to have your fortune told? -patrick --- Spot 1.3a #1649 * Origin: ====Patrick Ford====Auckland, NEW ZEALAND=====Fidonet: (3:772/235.3) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 221 UFO Ref: F5G00004 Date: 04/13/98 From: PATRICK FORD Time: 01:52am \/To: IVY IVERSON (Read 0 times) Subj: I'm back....(Look out!) In a message of 11 Apr 98 Ivy Iverson wrote to Ross Sauer: II> Hmmm... Well, they have done computer reconstructions of what the II> Sphynx looked like when it was first carved, (assuming THAT wasn't a II> natural "freak!), and it doesn't look a BIT like it does now! I wonder II> of some computer geek with a Cray will do a similar reconstruction of II> the "face" and we'll see what THAT looked like! I doubt very much that what you saw was a `computer reconstruction' any more than the pictures on science fiction covers are `reconstructions'. In ten minutes with PhotoShop, I can reconstruct the face on the Sphinx to look exactly like Elvis Presley. Would the fact that it was done on a computer instead of on paper lend it any legitimacy? To el cheapo journalists catering to low-level-consciousness type readers it probably would! -patrick --- Spot 1.3a #1649 * Origin: ====Patrick Ford====Auckland, NEW ZEALAND=====Fidonet: (3:772/235.3) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 221 UFO Ref: F5G00005 Date: 04/12/98 From: ROSS SAUER Time: 02:46am \/To: IVY IVERSON (Read 0 times) Subj: I'm back....(Look out!) -=> Quoting Ivy Iverson to Ross Sauer <=- ML> ... we already know that there are ML> extremely high winds and sandstorms on mars... what's to say that that ML> area hasn't undergone some extremely damaging weather since viking was ML> there? RS> Not enough to erase the "face" in only 20 years. II> II> AH-HEM!!! If you will recall, the origional photos were shot when the II> "face" was only lighted on one side, and about 1/3 of it was in total II> darkness, so it did not register! So where do you get 20 years, II> (since the first pictures, I know!), but the wind and blowing sand have II> had possibly THOUSANDS of years to destroy it if it WERE made by II> intelligent beings! Have you seen the computer reconstructions of what II> the Sphynx probably looked like when it was first carved? (Or was THAT II> a freak of "natural action" too???) LOL! First of all, I'd go with computer reconstructions in National Geographic, (I have that issue) NOT that *&%$#@ show "Sightings." I wouldn't trust them to tell me what color the sky is. RS> No, it was simply a screwup based on a poor resolution picture. RS> What would the area you live in look like from the air, based on a RS> photo with resolution of 1 mile? II> II> Not much different than a desert with lots of rocks. Exactly. ML> there will be no _proof_ until we actually land a man on mars and ML> detailed inspection of the area is made... RS> Even then the screwballs will yell "coverup!" :-( II> II> Hmmm... Well, they have done computer reconstructions of what the II> Sphynx looked like when it was first carved, (assuming THAT wasn't a II> natural "freak!), and it doesn't look a BIT like it does now! I wonder II> of some computer geek with a Cray will do a similar reconstruction of II> the "face" and we'll see what THAT looked like! See above. Ross Sauer patch@bbs.sts.net patch@bytehead.com ___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.20 [NR] --- TriToss (tm) 1.03 - (Unregistered) * Origin: Ivy's WALL BBS - Sheboygan, WI 920-457-9255 (1:154/170) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 221 UFO Ref: F5G00006 Date: 04/12/98 From: ROSS SAUER Time: 03:11am \/To: BOB KING (Read 0 times) Subj: Mars "face" -=> Quoting Bob King to Jack Sargeant <=- > I think it's time for the die-hards to give it up for > now, unless future > pictures are more artificial looking. I hate to say > this, but I'm starting > to think like the nay-sayers. BK> BK> Have you decoded the picture I sent you from pathfinder and if so what BK> do you make of it? BK> You might like to send a copy to Ross also and see what his opinion BK> is. I might already have it. I have several, from Art Bell's site and from NASA's site. Ross Sauer patch@bbs.sts.net patch@bytehead.com ___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.20 [NR] --- TriToss (tm) 1.03 - (Unregistered) * Origin: Ivy's WALL BBS - Sheboygan, WI 920-457-9255 (1:154/170) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 221 UFO Ref: F5G00007 Date: 04/12/98 From: ROSS SAUER Time: 08:33pm \/To: ALL (Read 0 times) Subj: Pigasus awards * Crossposted from: Skeptik The Pigasus Awards 1997 Announcing the official 1997 Pigasus Awards from the James Randi Educational Foundation On April 1st, we award the coveted Pigasus awards in four categories, for accomplishments in the period January 1/97 to December 31/97. The awards are announced via telepathy, the winners are allowed to predict their winning, and the Flying Pig trophies are sent via psychokinesis. We send; if they don't receive, that's probably due to their lack of ability. This year, we award the prizes to: Science: Dr. Michael Guillen Category #1, to the scientist who said or did the silliest thing related to the supernatural, paranormal or occult, goes to Dr. Michael Guillen of ABC-TV News. The science editor of ABC-TV's "Good Morning America" since 1988, Dr. Guillen has supported all manner of questionable "New Age" notions, usually by featuring endorsements by celebrities. Dr. Guillen holds Ph.D. degrees in physics, mathematics, and astronomy, and should know better. ABC-TV refers to him as, "a leader in this nation's campaign to eliminate science and math illiteracy." Judging from his indiscriminate promotion of pseudoscience and quackery, we don't think so. (See "Media" Award, below.) National Institutes of Health Category #2, to the funding organization that supported the most useless study of a supernatural, paranormal or occult, goes to the National Institutes of Health, whose budget for their Office of Alternative Healing began as two million dollars, and now amounts to twenty million. This money, originally marked to do "basic research" on alternative healing claims such as homeopathy, acupuncture, and chiropractic, has been dribbled away on peripheral claims of individual quack advocates. In our thinking, "basic research" should address such questions as, "Does chiropractic work?" rather than, "How much pressure is exerted on the spinal column by the thumbs of the chiropractor?" As we've said before, an apt definition of "the spinal column" is: "It supports the head, the neck, and the chiropractor." ABC-TV News Category #3, to the media outlet that reported as fact the most outrageous supernatural, paranormal or occult claim, the prize goes to ABC-TV News, for their unquestioning and enthusiastic endorsement of "cold fusion," ESP, psychokinesis, astrology, "magnetic therapy," and all sorts of junk science and highly questionable "alternative healing" modalities. Various winners Category #4, to the "psychic" performer who fooled the greatest number of people with the least effort, is given this year to all the psychics, astrologers, fortune tellers, spiritualists, and palm readers who, though they were consulted a matter of hours before her death, all failed to see any danger for Princess Di. These were the best of the best, highly paid and respected by Di and her friends. So much for professional help. The James Randi Educational Foundation 201 S.E. 12th St (E. Davie Blvd) Fort Lauderdale, FL 33316-1815, U.S.A. +1 954 467 1660 (fax)   +1 954 467 1112 (phone) randi@randi.org Ross Sauer patch@bbs.sts.net patch@bytehead.com ___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.20 [NR] --- TriToss (tm) 1.03 - (Unregistered) * Origin: Ivy's WALL BBS - Sheboygan, WI 920-457-9255 (1:154/170) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 221 UFO Ref: F5G00008 Date: 04/12/98 From: IVY IVERSON Time: 09:15pm \/To: JACK SARGEANT (Read 0 times) Subj: Phoenix lights? -=> On 04-10-98 18:03, Jack Sargeant said to Keith Morgan,<=- -=>"About UPN to Air Mexico UFO Vid...,"<=- Hi, Jack; [Big snip] JS> I also held high hopes for the Phoenix lights to be real, but I've JS> seen evidence that these were just flares dropping behind a mountain JS> ridge during an exercise by the Maryland National Guard. JS> At first, the military denied there were any aircraft in the area. JS> Later, the MNG fessed up. [Conspiracy buff's view - not necessarily mine!] :-] Uh huh... just like the military to come up with a cover story for a UFO a week after the sighting! JS> Actually, I suspect the exercise of being JS> one to determine the reaction from the public after seeing what JS> could easily mistaken for a giant UFO... JS> behind every bush. I wouldn't put it past them! JS> ...by those of us who see aliens... And unfortunately, some of us JS> do! Very true! JS> It is this JS> minority of us that has made the UFO enthusiasts the victim of abuse JS> by many of the hardcore skeptics, some of which are gung-ho to JS> ridicule believers. It would seem that there are a lot of these around! I hate to say it, (because it will only encourage them), but if they are trying to discredit SERIOUS UFO investigators, they are succeeding! JS> Fortunately for me, I was willing to view both the JS> Mexico City video and the Phoenix video with a view from both sides of JS> the fence. I haven't seen the Mexico City vid (yet), but one thing that could have proven or disproven the Phoenix lights event would be if a good observer had seen stars between the lights blacked out as "it" passed by. No blackouts, no huge object. Period. However if the stars WERE blacked out as "it" went by, that would completely disprove the O-fishy explaination of the Pentigon. JS> I am convinced the Mexico video was a fake, and the Phoenix JS> lights incident a terrible prank by our military on the general JS> public. Both are very possible! One question, however, _IF_ the Phoenix lights WERE a hoax by the military, why would they pull it if they are obviously trying so darn hard to convince John Q. Public that UFOs do _NOT_ exist??? This does not compute!!! And if it WAS the Maryland NG doing an exercize, why ditn't the Pentigon say so right away, or even announce it ahead of time? HMMMMMMmmmmmmmmmmmmmm... Catch you later... Keep l00king up! Ivy ... Just in... UFO takes Jack Sargeant... More after the League game. -- -=[ Ivy's WALL BBS <-KB9QPM-> www.bigfoot.com/~IvysWallBBS ]=- ___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.20 [NR] --- TriToss (tm) 1.03 - (Unregistered) * Origin: Ivy's WALL BBS - Sheboygan, WI 920-457-9255 (1:154/170)