--------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 186 SCUBA Ref: CC^00006 Date: 08/28/95 From: LEE BELL Time: 02:50pm \/To: DAN MISIASZEK (Read 1 times) Subj: Re: OLD GEAR - ANY GOOD?? -> Why is it that some are so afraid to dive with a puter? Or should -> I say, afraid to put faith into the puter and what it is designed -> to do? Darned if I know. I can think of a couple of possibilities: 1. Someone, somewhere has told these people that computers are not reliable. I can imagine saying something like "I don't need all that high tech stuff, I prefer to rely on myself than on my equipment (said before I tried a BC the first time). 2. Folks are not clear on the difference between "more down time" and more time at a given depth. Most of the advertisements I've seen focus on the fact that you get more bottom time with a computer, which we both know sounds like something it isn't...more time at the bottom. 3. People who don't trust dive computers are perhaps confusing them with computers like you and I are using now. Hell, if my dive computer crashed as often as this one, particularly since I started using Windows, I wouldn't trust it much either. Lord knows, there's been enough explanation of the benefits that everyone should understand by now, but alas, they don't. Lee --- PCBoard (R) v15.21/M 2 * Origin: The Cross Roads BBS Ft. Lauderdale, Fla 305-791-9325 (1:369/97) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 186 SCUBA Ref: CC^00007 Date: 08/28/95 From: LEE BELL Time: 02:55pm \/To: CARL WILSON (Read 1 times) Subj: Nitrox -> Regular air fill in WV......$3.25-$4.25 -> Nitrox (32%)..........$7.30 more O2 is generally little more -> expensive. Hmmm, you've given me something to think about. I'm not sure I care enough to make the switch since most of my diving is relatively shallow, I generally don't use the bottom time I have available and never, never push my no-deco times. On the other hand, the information I've been seeing about the new re-breather equipment sounds very interesting. I suspect my photography would improve dramatically if all those bubbles I make weren't around to scare off the marine life. However, in addition to be hideously expensive to buy, I'll bet the annual service is also a bitch. Lee --- PCBoard (R) v15.21/M 2 * Origin: The Cross Roads BBS Ft. Lauderdale, Fla 305-791-9325 (1:369/97) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 186 SCUBA Ref: CC^00008 Date: 08/28/95 From: LEE BELL Time: 02:59pm \/To: STAN DEAN (Read 1 times) Subj: Tanks and Hydros -> LB>->Where I come from, filling a tank to 3300 psi is a compliment -> and LB>-> widely practiced. If wish the tanks would go to 5000 -> safely, but LB>-> they don't. Most blow off relief valves will bust -> at 3700 or less. LB>-> As long as you have not mistreated your alum -> 80, haven't painted or LB>-> baked it, and have regular hydro, 3300 -> is no problem. -> -> Stan babbled while trying to remember his DM class: -> -> when a tank is hydroed it is put under extreme pressure. -> Yes while after years of use a tank may become fatiged(sp). -> But don't forget that a tank that is rated for whatever pressure can -> be marked to provide 10% more working pressure if rated after a -> hydro. I know. It's really not that I worry about the tank, that's kind of an excuse. The real issue is that I prefer to play by the rules unless I have a good reason not to, and I don't. I have to admit, however, that I worry a little (not a lot) about a dive shop that routinely breaks the fill rules. It makes me wonder if they are breaking any other rules, like compressor maintenance for example. Lee --- PCBoard (R) v15.21/M 2 * Origin: The Cross Roads BBS Ft. Lauderdale, Fla 305-791-9325 (1:369/97) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 186 SCUBA Ref: CC^00009 Date: 08/28/95 From: LEE BELL Time: 03:02pm \/To: DAN MISIASZEK (Read 1 times) Subj: Re: CERTIFICATION. -> DB> Why dive 100 hours, ingraining bad habits before going for DB> -> more training? We'd like to think people are diving 100 hours perfecting the good habits they learned (or were supposed to) in their training. Lee --- PCBoard (R) v15.21/M 2 * Origin: The Cross Roads BBS Ft. Lauderdale, Fla 305-791-9325 (1:369/97) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 186 SCUBA Ref: CC^00010 Date: 08/28/95 From: LEE BELL Time: 03:31pm \/To: DON ZANDSTRA (Read 1 times) Subj: Re: certification. Hmmmm, I guess I lied when I said I'd done it all. Water below about 68 degrees has not and shall not see my body. As neat as looking up at ice almost certainly is, I'll pass. Lee --- PCBoard (R) v15.21/M 2 * Origin: The Cross Roads BBS Ft. Lauderdale, Fla 305-791-9325 (1:369/97) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 186 SCUBA Ref: CC^00011 Date: 08/28/95 From: LEE BELL Time: 03:36pm \/To: JEOFF FREED (Read 1 times) Subj: Re: Diving Deaths -> Blue Springs is not a cave system. It is actually a cavern.. When -> looking at it from a side view, it looks like a leg with a foot -> attached to it. You can almost make a straight surface accent from -> the 90 - 100 foot mark ( the ankle). Maybe this will help you with -> understanding how Lee Bell made it out... The description above is correct as far as it goes. The system, at least the portion you can access is shaped kind of like a foot and, as I recall (it's been a while), you enter beneith a large tree and drop straight to about 45 feet. From there, you angle down the main cavern. About 100 feet sound right (bottom of the ankle?). I was down around the toe. My depth guage read 128 feet, that I do remember. The definition I use for cave versus cavern is one of visibility. If you can see surface light, even in a small amount, its a cavern. If not, it's a cave. I could see no light except what I brought with me. I have no way of knowing if my definition is correct now or, in fact, ever was. Regardless, I guess it is important to note that there were no narrow passages, multiple passages or anything else nasty between me and the surface. Also, there was a permanent line visible to me at all times. As far as finding the proper exit, it was pretty much a flat swim through the foot, a rising swim through the ankle and a fast ride to the surface through the leg. The entire exit was helped by a rapid flow of water in my favor. About the only wrong turn I could have made was to rise in the cavern section (foot). To do that, I would have had to swim away from the permanent line, something very unlikely when it is my only path to more air. At any rate, I don't recommend others try to repeat my performance. More than one diver has died in Blue Springs and it was luck (and a lack of panic) that kept me from being one. It certainly wasn't skill. Even by the standards of the day, close to 30 years ago, diving alone in a cave was a pretty stupid stunt. Lee --- PCBoard (R) v15.21/M 2 * Origin: The Cross Roads BBS Ft. Lauderdale, Fla 305-791-9325 (1:369/97) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 186 SCUBA Ref: CC^00012 Date: 08/25/95 From: JAY HANIG Time: 06:17pm \/To: RALPH BUTTIGIEG (Read 1 times) Subj: tanks 23 Aug 95 09:56, Ralph Buttigieg wrote to Terry Smith: RB> If I understand this right, steel tanks have the advantage of weighing RB> less for the given capacity and are less bouyant, therefore divers need RB> less lead in their weight belts. But what are the disadvantages? Do they RB> cost more? Superior buoyancy characteristics are steel's biggest advantage. They also come in a better variety of sizes than aluminum tanks. However, there is one major disadvantage......they can rust. Steel tanks, even painted steel tanks have a galvanized coating on the outside which will prevent rust. Unfortunately, it's not possible to galvanize the interior of the tank (for health reasons....zinc is a heavy metal and does nasty things to your liver). If moisture enters your tank, either by being pumped in by a compressor with saturated filters or by draining the tank empty so no pressure remains inside to keep it out, then the metal oxidizes (or rusts). The rust can have two deleterious effects: First it weakens the walls of the tank, making catastrophic failure a possibility if it goes far enough. This is a fairly rare event. More commonly, the rust particles shear off and pass into your regulator, where they will do no good. There is a sintered filter which is supposed to catch rust, but I've rebuilt hundreds of regs in my day, and I can tell you a filter can only do so much. There are those who will correctly point out that aluminum tanks also oxidize, but the characteristics of aluminum oxide are completely different. Rather than shearing off to wreak havoc in your reg, it tends to be tightly binding to the walls of the cylinder, effectively protecting the the walls from further oxidation. The final thoughts I have on the matter concern the electrolysis which may occur between the tank and tank valve. The contact of any dissimilar metals in the presence of saltwater may cause electrolysis. Since we visually inspect tanks every year, only a moron would forget to lubricate the neck of the valve. By doing this annual lubrication, you effectively negate the consequences of electrolysis (which would be for the valve to "freeze" onto the tank). I don't work in the diving industry any more, as I've moved on to better paying pastures, but for my money aluminum is the way to go. Your mileage may vary. Jay PADI M-9033 --- MeanMail 2.15 * Origin: ** Jay's Mean Machine Sysop *Charlotte, NC* USR 33.6 ** (1:379/41.5) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 186 SCUBA Ref: CC^00013 Date: 08/26/95 From: JAY HANIG Time: 10:55pm \/To: DIANE BOETTCHER (Read 1 times) Subj: CERTIFICATION. 24 Aug 95 16:41, Diane Boettcher wrote to Dan Misiaszek: DM>> Normally when I think of a master DM>> diver I think of a guy with years of experience. I wish there was a DM>> way of establishing some criteria for a certification instead of just DM>> paying you money. A minimum of 100 hours prior to advanced, and DM>> 500hrs for Master Diver. Or something similar. DB> This idea comes up every once in a while. The certification implies DB> training, which does implies *some* experience (after all most DB> specialities require dives). DB> I prefer divers to get their experience with an instructor or DB> divemaster, learning new things and fine tuning their basic diving DB> skills. Why dive 100 hours, ingraining bad habits before going for more DB> training? I don't agree completely. I hold both a Master Diver and Master Instructor rating and I logged many a dive between courses. I think that diving ONLY with an instructor or divemaster leads a person to develop a dependance on them for major decision making and planning. It's sort of like hiring a new pilot into a copilot slot without him first acquiring the years of experience flying weather. You may develop a fine First Officer, but he will lack the command mind set that people who've made their own mistakes develop. He becomes a great FO but an indecisive Captain. Make sense? Jay PADI M-9033 --- MeanMail 2.15 * Origin: ** Jay's Mean Machine Sysop *Charlotte, NC* USR 33.6 ** (1:379/41.5) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 186 SCUBA Ref: CC^00014 Date: 08/26/95 From: JAY HANIG Time: 11:03pm \/To: DAN MISIASZEK (Read 1 times) Subj: diving deaths 25 Aug 95 15:29, Dan Misiaszek wrote to Don Zandstra: DZ>> I have seen SCUBA instructors that have had less dives under DZ>> their belts than my newest equipment. DM> I agree this is a problem. There should be mandatory amount of bottom DM> time before you can take an instructor class. Effectively, there is. I wouldn't take just anyone into my Divemaster or Assistant Instructor programs. First, I got to know them.....personally and by diving with them on numerous occasions. Then, if I liked what I saw, I'd take them on. Open Water and Advanced Open Water classes wwere taught for the income. Divemaster and above were taught for the love of the sport. I blew off folks that I didn't think were suited. As far as that went, I don't recall ever charging for teaching Divemasters. Jay PADI M-9033 --- MeanMail 2.15 * Origin: ** Jay's Mean Machine *Charlotte, NC* USR 33.6 ** (1:379/41.5) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 186 SCUBA Ref: CC^00015 Date: 08/27/95 From: JAY HANIG Time: 04:40am \/To: DAN MISIASZEK (Read 1 times) Subj: CERTIFICATION. 26 Aug 95 00:59, Dan Misiaszek wrote to Diane Boettcher: DB>> Why dive 100 hours, ingraining bad habits before going for DB>> more training? DM> This was exactly what I was saying about training DM> and experience. I agree totally, however I was screamed at DM> for sharing my opinion. When I want your opinion, I'll kill myself. Jay --- MeanMail 2.15 * Origin: ** Jay's Mean Machine *Charlotte, NC* USR 33.6 ** (1:379/41.5)