--------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 180 ASTRONOMY Ref: F3E00047 Date: 03/08/98 From: BARTON PAUL LEVENSON Time: 07:12pm \/To: KEITH KNAPP (Read 2 times) Subj: S of L. KK> Is there anything to that idea that cannot be explained by our KK> florid anthropomorphism and our need to make teleologies? KK> I like what some of the Buddhists say: the universe just is. And I like what some of the Christians say: In the beginning, God created the heaven and the earth. KK> In a funny sort of way, the 20th century may turn out to be the KK> most spiritual century of all -- we are going to have to separate KK> our magical thinking from whatever spirituality is. With any supernaturalism you don't like the sound of included under "magical thinking?" --- Maximus 3.01 * Origin: SoundingBoard, Pittsburgh PA (1:129/26) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 180 ASTRONOMY Ref: F3E00048 Date: 03/08/98 From: BARTON PAUL LEVENSON Time: 07:14pm \/To: LANCE REYNOLDS (Read 2 times) Subj: Physics News Updates LR> In fact, with my feeble understanding of the numbers involved, it LR> seems fantastic to me that there is anyone alive who could possibly LR> accept as truth that we are the only ones looking and wondering at the LR> stars. You were doing okay talking about objectivity until you got to this section, then you apparently dropped any pretense of objectivity without realizing you were doing it. I think ETI is very probable, but I could be wrong, and there happen to be many people, many of them with science degrees, who think we are the only intelligent life in the Universe, or at least in this galaxy. I can't prove them wrong with probability; eventually we will have to go out and look to make sure one way or the other. Some civilization has to be the first one to wake up in a given galaxy; it is possible, though not likely, that we are it. --- Maximus 3.01 * Origin: SoundingBoard, Pittsburgh PA (1:129/26) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 180 ASTRONOMY Ref: F3E00049 Date: 03/09/98 From: MIKE PELL Time: 12:04pm \/To: ARNOLD G. GILL (Read 2 times) Subj: BB theory Hello Arnold. While on the Internet I came across this file concerning the Big Bang theory. Any opinions to the author's points raised? Top Ten Problems with the Big Bang Tom Van Flandern Meta Research For a recent chat discussion on MSN, we prepared a list of the leading problems faced by the big bang in its struggle for viability as a theory: 1. Static universe models fit the data better than expanding universe models. 2. The microwave "background" makes more sense as the limiting temperature of space heated by starlight than as the remnant of a fireball. 3. Element abundance predictions using the big bang require too many adjustable parameters to make them work. 4. The universe has too much large scale structure (interspersed "walls" and voids) to form in a time as short as 10-20 billion years. 5. The average luminosity of quasars must decrease with time in just the right way so that their mean apparent brightness is the same at all redshifts, which is exceedingly unlikely. 6. The ages of globular clusters appear older than the universe. 7. The local streaming motions of galaxies are too high for a finite universe that is supposed to be everywhere uniform. 8. Invisible dark matter of an unknown but non-baryonic nature must be the dominant ingredient of the entire universe. 9. The most distant galaxies in the Hubble Deep Field show insufficient evidence of evolution, with some of them apparently having higher redshifts (z = 6-7) than the faintest quasars. 10. If the open universe we see today is extrapolated back near the beginning, the ratio of the actual density of matter in the universe to the critical density must differ from unity by just a part in 1059. Any larger deviation would result in a universe already collapsed on itself or already dissipated. Meta Research Bulletin Volume 6, Number 4 December 15, 1997 http://www.metaresearch.org/mrb/top10BBproblems.htm mp | AmiQWK 2.9 - FREEWARE | ... --- PCBoard (R) v15.4/M 5 Beta * Origin: The GameBoard BBS-9056893982/9409-BurlingtonONCANADA (1:244/506) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 180 ASTRONOMY Ref: F3E00050 Date: 03/10/98 From: BOB KING Time: 07:56am \/To: MIKE ROSS (Read 2 times) Subj: Physics News Updates Hi, > Science doesn't have beliefs. It has only the > certainty of fact. Mike, I am astounded that you would make such a statement. Are you sure you meant that? sig rex --- FMail/386 1.22 * Origin: Bob's Point, Christchurch New Zealand (3:770/115.16) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 180 ASTRONOMY Ref: F3E00051 Date: 03/06/98 From: DAVE LORD Time: 09:35pm \/To: CRAIG MACDOUGAL (Read 2 times) Subj: Re: A Quick Observation -=> Quoting Craig Macdougal to All <=- CM> @TID: PX/Win v2.0 PX96-0466 CM> @MSGID: 1:3603/140 f1ab4ffa CM> Hi Gang, CM> CM> Upon checking with various computer sooth-sayers (who said unto CM> Clear Skies, CM> Craig in Tampa ........and you said that you were going 'lurking' for a while... when I accidently blew your cover at your new FIDO site. Does this message indicate that you are back in la la land again with the rest of us?? ............. <<<||;-))........... ... Dave Lord at Stargate REGULUS, Coconut Creek, FL =>lord@gate.net ___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12 --- Platinum Xpress/Win/Wildcat5! v2.0 * Origin: Alliance BBS +1(954) 941 7574 Pompano Beach, FL USA (1:369/80) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 180 ASTRONOMY Ref: F3E00052 Date: 03/08/98 From: FORD PREFECT Time: 11:24am \/To: BOB KING (Read 2 times) Subj: S of L. BK> Hi, > The redshift is really due to the distant objects > moving faster in > relation to us. BK> Surely if the above is correct then the expansion of BK> the universe must be increasing in speed relative to us Not neccasrily. The universe could be expanding at a speed greater than ours,but a stable speed. BK> and eventually something we can see, will simply BK> disappear relative to us and hence will have achieved, BK> relative to us, the speed of light, which is not BK> possible (so I am told) as its mass would become BK> infinite, even if only relative to us. Then there is the believe thqt the universe my very well collapse, or close itself at that point. I personally do not possess the knowledge to speak with any degree of certainty on which is the most likely though. --- Maximus 2.02 * Origin: The Recipe Corner (1:321/155) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 180 ASTRONOMY Ref: F3E00053 Date: 03/10/98 From: MIKE ROSS Time: 12:39am \/To: BARTON PAUL LEVENSON (Read 2 times) Subj: Re: Physics News Updates Barton Paul Levenson said the following to Lance Reynolds on the subject of Physics News Updates (08 Mar 98 19:14:30) LR> In fact, with my feeble understanding of the numbers involved, it LR> seems fantastic to me that there is anyone alive who could possibly LR> accept as truth that we are the only ones looking and wondering at the LR> stars. BPL> You were doing okay talking about objectivity until you got to this BPL> section, BPL> Some civilization has to be the first one BPL> to wake up in a given galaxy; it is possible, though not likely, that BPL> we are it. I agree, a lot is possible and I'm reminded that the atoms which make up our Sun, and circumstantially ourselves, are the byproduct of at least 3 generations of stars gone nova that came before us. These all had to die to make the heavy elements we find in our solar system today. As such, life in the universe, or at least in our galactic neighborhood, may have existed as far back as 6 billion years or more. The odds of biological life evolving other than on the Earth would therefore be much higher since after all the universe is infinite and more ancient than where we are. I find it logical to think that biological life is common in the universe and that it may have slowly but steadily spread everywhere for example inside dirty snowballs such as comets. Panspermia is not totally implausible. In our case, we would more likely be the Johnny Come Lately's than the 1st sentient beings to evolve. However, that lucky possibility exists that even though life may be common in the universe, we are the first to know we know. Still, it's pretty narcissistic to put it into a religion. Oh..., they have? --- Blue Wave/DOS v2.30 * Origin: Juxtaposition BBS. Lasalle, Quebec, Canada (1:167/133) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 180 ASTRONOMY Ref: F3E00054 Date: 03/08/98 From: SHANE DAY Time: 12:16am \/To: ALL (Read 2 times) Subj: Near Earth Asteroid I'm looking for information on a specific asteroid and was wondering if someone would be able to help. The asteroid I'm trying to get information on is NEA 1979 VA, any suggestion on where I could find information on this asteroid? Or specifically how far from earth it is. - Shane ... ERROR: ERROR: ERROR: ERROR: ERROR: {SMACK} C:\ --- Blue Wave v2.12 * Origin: BitByters BBS, Rockland ON, Can. (613)446-7773 v34, (1:163/215) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 180 ASTRONOMY Ref: F3F00000 Date: 03/05/98 From: PAUL M. DAVIS Time: 10:48pm \/To: ALL (Read 2 times) Subj: Planetary Alignment Someone in the PHYSICS echo has stated that all the planets in our solar system will be aligned on 5th March 2000. Can anyone verify this for me as I've not heard of this myself? Paul ... Bother, said Pooh as he was dumped from the Matrix. --- Spot 1.3a #1413 * Origin: In an atomic war, all men will be cremated equal. (2:254/524.18) --------------- FIDO MESSAGE AREA==> TOPIC: 180 ASTRONOMY Ref: F3F00001 Date: 03/10/98 From: ADAM MAJER Time: 07:11pm \/To: BARTON PAUL LEVENSON (Read 2 times) Subj: News from Io question BPL>DM> LR> Isn't one of Jove's moons full of water? BPL>DM>There has been some water detected by the BPL>DM>spectrometers I believe, but I dou BPL>DM>if any moon is full of it. BPL> AM> What about Europa?!? Fulla water! BPL>Callisto may be, too -- no clear evidence yet. Callisto is rocks and stuff. There might be _some_ water but not like on Europa. * SLMR 2.1a * I'm in shape ... round's a shape isn't it? --- GEcho 1.00 * Origin: -= The Dragon's Lair =- (204)269-2164...Wpg.MB (1:348/943)